Mountains and democracy have something in common: they don’t manage themselves.

In this episode, Greg talks again with Pacific Time pal Gwyn Howat, longtime leader of Mount Baker Ski Area and advocate for public lands, fresh off a trip to Washington, D.C. Gwyn met with members of Congress and leaders of the U.S. Forest Service to speak up for the future of the commons — the mountains, forests, and public spaces that shape life on the West Coast.

Her trip came amid massive cuts to federal agencies that oversee national forests — proposals to slash jobs, consolidate regional offices, and even sell off public lands. Gwyn’s clear-eyed perspective offers both warning and hope: warning about the hollowing out of government, and hope in the resilience of dedicated public servants and everyday advocates.

Together, Greg and Gwyn discuss:

• The fragility of federal agencies — and why we still need good people in them
• The role of private enterprise on public lands, and the promise of social purpose corporations
• How recreation now contributes more to the U.S. Forest Service than timber
• The bipartisan common ground she found in Congress — a shared love of the outdoors – that may point the way to compromises in many areas
• What it means to steward democracy itself, not just mountains
• A citizen’s call to action: writing Congress works

This episode continues the Pacific Time theme of West Coast autonomy — not in rebellion, but in responsibility. As the federal government withdraws, West Coasters may need to step forward: to protect public lands, fund stewardship, and remind Washington, D.C. what it means to serve the greater good in the long run.

Highlights

• “Things are fragile right now… but that means all possibilities exist.”
• “Outdoor recreation now contributes more to the Forest Service than timber.”
• “A walk in the woods, a swim in the ocean — everyone agrees those things do us good.”
• “Forests exist because people fought for them. Democracies do, too.”

Guest Bio

Gwyn Howat is the former CEO of Mt. Baker Ski Area and a lifelong advocate for responsible recreation and stewardship of public lands. She has spent more than 35 years shaping Mount Baker’s culture as a family-run operation deeply tied to community and conservation. She just brought that perspective to Washington, D.C., meeting with Congress and the U.S. Forest Service to advocate for the future of public lands and the people who care for them. Gwyn’s next chapter is now taking shape – she continues to focus on supporting independent ski areas, and increasingly to guiding people experiencing trauma into mindfulness, seeing the good, and rich experiences in nature.

Join the Conversation
Where are the places that you flourish that have become fragile? And what would you say in a letter to your Member of Congress to convey what’s so special about that place? Follow, share, and chime in…

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Related Resources

• The USDA Forest Service–The First Century
• “Gifford Pinchot: The Father of Forestry,” National Parks Service
• “The USDA Wants to Close Every Forest Service Regional Office with Reorganization Plan,” Bikepacking.com
• “Social Purpose Corporations: What, Why, How,” Summit Law Group
• “Colorado lawmakers revive SHRED Act in Congress for the third time,” The Aspen Times, Feb 7, 2025
• “Seligman’s PERMA+ Model Explained: A Theory of Wellbeing,” PositivePsychology.com, Feb 24, 2017
• Mount Baker Ski Area
  
  

Related Episodes

• 20 Could Duct Tape Save Our Public Lands? With Gwyn Howat (Part 1)
• 19 Could Roman Ruins Inspire West Coast Offense?
• 05 What if Nature Defined Our Borders in the Cascadia Bioregion? With Yogi Uriah
  
  

Thanks to…

• Guest: Gwyn Howat (Again!)
• USFS Rangers and Administrators
• Gifford Pinchot for so accurately portraying the public lands balancing act
• Producers: Tim Wohlberg, Valerie McTavish