Very Bad Therapy

By Ben Fineman and Caroline Wiita

What's Very Bad Therapy about?

Very Bad Therapy is a closer look at what goes wrong in the counseling room - and how it could go better - as told by the clients who survived.

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Very Bad Therapy episodes:

09.18.2023
147. Termination Session
Thank you for listening!
09.04.2023
146. Patreon Selects: Carrie-Ben Therapy (aka CBT 2.0)
Carrie and Ben create their own model of therapy. Goal setting! Psychoeducation! Exploitation and worrisome sales tactics! What does it say about psychotherapy when our progressively cynical efforts to develop a modality end up mirroring some of the norms...
08.21.2023
145. Patreon Selects: Book Review - All Therapy Books
All therapy books have an oddly similar message: *This* form of therapy is the one that truly matters, and *this* science/philosophy/whatever is the key to understanding how human psychology actually works. These narratives can’t all be true, so are...
08.07.2023
144. The Shrink Next State
The vast majority of therapists enter their profession to help other people. Some become therapists to help themselves. Today’s episode features Millie, a client who found a therapist who seemed to good to be true – until the truth set...
07.24.2023
143. Patreon Selects: Fun With the Psychology Today Profile Generator
Life can be hard at times. Do you want to feel more visible and important in your relationships? Are you curious about why every Psychology Today profile looks the same? We get silly with the incredible Therapist Generator and...
07.17.2023
142. VBT Study Hall: Client Testimonials and Reviews
Social proof has become a crucial element of consumer decision making in the Internet era. So why don’t the vast majority of therapists ask their clients to give testimonials or leave reviews? We ponder the frustrating tension between psychotherapy ethics...
07.03.2023
141. “Not All Christians…” (with Josh Foster, LCPC)
What is religious trauma, and why do some therapists refuse to work with clients who use that language? In today’s episode, Jeremy speaks about his experiences with therapists who felt the need to defend their faith in session, and we...
06.19.2023
140. VBT Study Hall: What Does “Trauma-Informed” Mean?
Trauma-informed therapy is…what, exactly? And is trauma actually stored in the body, or is that just a clever narrative that a few enterprising gurus have used to sell books and trainings? We dig deep into the research on trauma to...
06.05.2023
139. Politics in the Therapy Room (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)
Let’s get controversial! Is it a good idea for a therapist to project their own political views onto a client? For today’s guest Ruth, the answer is a resounding “no.” We hear her story of a therapist who took her...
05.22.2023
138. Patreon Selects: Is EMDR a Cultish Pyramid Scheme?
No, EMDR is not a cultish pyramid scheme. With that out of the way, why is EMDR training so expensive when its theoretical foundations are supported by dubious (at best) research? In this clickbaity-titled episode, Angela Nauss, EMDRIA-certified LMFT, joins...
05.15.2023
137. VBT Study Hall: Evaluating Research
How do we know which psychotherapy research is trustworthy? Dr. Alex Williams and Dr. John Sakaluk help us search for evidence in all the logical places: the replication crisis, RCTs, qualitative studies, dolphin therapy, Canadian football, researchers fighting Connor McGregor,...
05.01.2023
136. Very Bad Group Therapy
What makes for effective group therapy? Cohesion, expectation setting, and as today’s guest Thomas can attest to, not having the therapist give the middle finger to a group member. We try to make sense of Thomas’ experience by looking into...
04.17.2023
135. VBT Study Hall: Treatment Planning
What exactly is treatment planning and why do some therapists dread having to do it on a regular basis? This episode is Carrie’s love letter to treatment plans – why they are used, how they can improve therapy outcomes, and...
04.03.2023
134. Neurodiversity and Diagnosis (with Halina Brooke, LAMFT)
What’s so important about a diagnosis? For neurodivergent clients, it can mean affirmation, community support, and access to much-needed services…if the diagnosis is correct. In today’s episode, we talk to Harley about her challenges in seeking diagnoses of autism and...
03.20.2023
133. VBT Study Hall: Termination
Nothing lasts forever, including therapeutic relationships. Therapy can end in lots of different ways, but what constitutes a good goodbye? We dig into the research on termination and the related ethics codes and come away with a surprising conclusion: firing...
03.06.2023
132. Some Bad Parts (with Dr. Sheila Addison)
“No bad parts” is a common mantra in therapy – the various parts of ourselves are always working to serve some beneficial purpose. But what happens when a therapist communicates to a client that significant parts of who they are...
02.20.2023
131. VBT Study Hall: First Sessions
What happens in the first session of therapy? More importantly, why do one-third of clients not come back for the second session? We look for answers in the research on client expectations and consider some creative perspectives on increasing first...
02.06.2023
130. Gambling Therapy
Is good therapy as simple as whatever activity makes a client feel better? What if that activity is a singular focus on sports betting strategy? In today’s episode, we talk with Christine to learn from her experience of “gambling therapy”...
01.23.2023
129. Patreon Selects: Will Carrie Ever Get Licensed?
Carrie hasn’t worked as a therapist in over a year. Will she ever get licensed, and how is her decision connected to the apparent reality that many therapists are actively trying to not see clients? We explore the interesting trend...
01.16.2023
128. VBT Study Hall: The Therapeutic Alliance
You’ve already heard that the therapeutic alliance is important to client outcomes, but does anyone actually know why? We dig into the research to figure out if ruptures can be a good thing (yes!), what clients and therapists should know...
01.02.2023
127. Enlightenment is Not a Treatment Goal (with Dr. Jim Jobin)
Many clients want a spiritual component to their therapy, but what happens when a therapist acts more like a theologian than a mental health professional? Today’s guest Kelsey describes her experience of having spirituality weaponized against her in sessions, and...
12.19.2022
126. VBT Study Hall: Interventions
It seems odd that most therapists – us included – aren’t 100% certain about what constitutes an intervention. Are interventions scripted in-session activities? What about the theoretical orientations themselves? There isn’t one single answer, but interventions aren’t that difficult to...
12.05.2022
125. So You’ve Stereotyped Your Client (with Deanna Fierman, LPC)
Stereotypes aren’t always a bad thing. That may not be true in therapy, especially when a client is made to feel like they are representing an entire group of people. That’s what we explore with today’s guest Jess, and we’re...
11.21.2022
124. VBT Study Hall: Theoretical Orientations
There are over 600 types of psychotherapy. What are they, where did they come from, and what makes them important? We dive deep (too deep, probably) into a $900 textbook in an attempt to make sense of the spectacularly confusing...
11.14.2022
Bonus: Clinical Licensing Exams Don't Work (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)
In the United States, mental health professionals must pass a clinical exam to become licensed in their field. These exams appear to do nothing to make psychotherapy more effective or safe. They are, however, very efficient at furthering structural racism....
11.07.2022
123. Catching Feelings (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)
It’s not unusual for clients to develop feelings for their therapist. It’s also not unusual for therapists to develop feelings for their clients. So why is it such a bad idea for a therapist to share (or act) on those...
10.24.2022
122. Patreon Selects: Degrees of Confusion (Part II)
Justin Norris rejoins us to conclude our conversation about the perplexing maze that is the application process for grad school. We use the California State University (CSU) system as a case study to illustrate why program requirements aren’t always what...
10.17.2022
121. Patreon Selects: Degrees of Confusion (Part I)
Have you ever wondered why the process of applying to grad school is so unclear at times? In part one of two, we are joined by Justin Norris, an expert in systems of higher education, to talk about the surprisingly...
10.03.2022
120. Hard Conversations
What happens when a therapist doesn’t want to work with a client? What should happen? Tom shares his experience with a therapist who chose avoidance over honesty, and we discuss ten types of hard conversations that frequently give therapists anxiety....
09.19.2022
119. Patreon Selects: The Intersections of Philosophy and Psychotherapy
Dr. Sally Gibbons is an Oxford-educated philosopher, professor of bioethics and philosophy at UCLA, and licensed professional clinical counselor. We discuss her academic background, what inspired her transition to a career in mental health, and how philosophical thinking informs her...
09.05.2022
118. Testing Patients (with Rachel Simon, LCSW)
Psychological testing can be complicated. It shouldn’t have to be hostile, even if the evaluation is not intended to be in a client’s best interest. In today’s episode, Jacob shares his experience of a truly ridiculous psych assessment, and we...
08.22.2022
117. Patreon Selects: The History of Expertise in Therapy (Part II)
The history of expertise in medicine and science led the field of psychotherapy to its beloved empirically supported treatments (ESTs). Psychiatrists were prescribing pills, and psychotherapists were offering best practices. But how did these best practices get their reputation, and...
08.15.2022
116. Patreon Selects: The History of Expertise in Therapy (Part I)
Therapists are considered mental health experts. How did this come to be, and is it necessary for the future of the field? Join us as we trace the surprising history of the medical model in therapy from its origins in...
08.01.2022
115. What is Bad Therapy, and Who Gets to Provide It? (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)
Today’s guest Marie shares her thought-provoking story about a preoccupied telehealth therapist, and we drag Dr. Ben Caldwell into another one of our philosophical crises about what constitutes very bad therapy. Is it not following a treatment plan? Having young...
07.18.2022
114. Patreon Selects: An Actor, a Sommelier, and a Poker Player Walk Into a Bar
Carrie and Ben are joined by friend of the podcast Rachel Bennett to talk about how their past careers have shaped their identities as therapists. Topics include: How working in fine dining informs the importance of being of service...
07.04.2022
113. Psychedelics and Therapy (with Ben Hearn, LPCC-S)
Consciousness-altering psychedelic drugs have shown tremendous promise in mental health treatment. The future of psychedelic-assisted therapy is uncertain, but one thing seems clear: the psychedelics are for the client, not the therapist. Today’s guest Matthew shares his peculiar experience with...
06.20.2022
112. Patreon Selects: Desperate Remedies for Mental Illness
Dr. Andrew Scull is the Distinguished Professor of Sociology, Emeritus, at UCSD. He has written extensively about the history of psychiatry and the treatment of madness. We discuss why it seems like the more you know about mental illness, the...
06.06.2022
111. Talking About Antisemitism (with Halina Brooke, LAMFT)
The field of psychotherapy has increasingly prioritized discussions about issues of oppression and marginalization. This is, of course, a sign of progress. But who gets left out of these conversations? Today’s guest Kaley shares her experience of antisemitism in therapy,...
05.23.2022
110. Patreon Selects: The VBT Guide to Grad School (Part II)
We’re back with Dr. Ben Caldwell to conclude our thoughts on grad school and the surprising reality that it isn’t meant to make you a good therapist. We talk about starting supervision, avoiding moral injury, and most importantly, all the...
05.16.2022
109. Patreon Selects: The VBT Guide to Grad School (Part I)
Dr. Ben Caldwell joins us to discuss everything you need to know about going to school to become a therapist. His most important message? Treat grad school like a convenience store – get in and get out. We explore how...
05.02.2022
108. The Inevitable CBT Episode (with Alyssa Davis, LMFT)
Of course we were going to end up doing an episode about CBT eventually. Emily describes visiting a CBT therapist who seemed uninterested in doing any real work, and Alyssa Davis joins us to cognitively restructure our beliefs about therapy...
04.25.2022
Bonus: Introducing the Learn Psychotherapy Podcast
Ben and Carrie have a new podcast! It’s called Learn Psychotherapy, and we’re inviting you to listen and practice along to develop your therapy skills. Learn Psychotherapy: Website / YouTube / Apple Podcasts / Spotify Skill...
04.18.2022
107. Patreon Selects: Ask Us Anything!
We’re long overdue for a good old-fashioned Q&A; episode. You’ve sent in your questions, and we’re here to opine about everything from the importance of therapists getting their own therapy to the curious reluctance of the mental health field to...
04.04.2022
106. Psycho, Education
What happens when a therapist and client have two very different conversational styles? Therapists can try to build rapport in many ways, which unfortunately is reflected in our guest Ben’s experience of being given terrible advice mislabeled as psychoeducation. Whether...
03.21.2022
105. Patreon Selects: The Elephant in the Therapy Room
Dr. Robin Hanson is an associate professor of economics at George Mason University and the coauthor of The Elephant in the Brain: Hidden Motives in Everyday Life. He joins us along with guest host Dr. Alex Williams to explore what...
03.07.2022
104. Crises in the Time of Intake (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)
When does somebody officially become a client of therapy? And what happens if, before that distinction is made, crises occur and the therapeutic relationship unravels? Our guest Neith shares her experience navigating this scenario, and Dr. Ben Caldwell explains why...
02.21.2022
103. Patreon Selects: The Therapists’ Side of the Story
On Very Bad Therapy, we seek to understand what it’s like for clients to have bad therapeutic experiences. Should we focus more on the therapists’ side of the story? Dr. Patrick Wiita joins us to continue our conversation from the...
02.07.2022
102. The Good and Bad of Dialectical Behavior Therapy (with Fred Kutnick, LCSW)
Dialectical behavior therapy (DBT) is considered the front-line treatment for borderline personality disorder. What exactly is DBT, and why is it nothing like the invalidating experience that Amy describes in today’s episode? To accept and change the reality of bad...
01.31.2022
101. Bonus: Hollywood and Mental Health (with Thomas Lennon)
Thomas Lennon is an acclaimed actor and screenwriter, best-selling novelist, and most importantly, Carrie’s long-time friend. We break from our usual format to chat with Tom about his good experiences in therapy, the impact of fame on mental health, and...
01.17.2022
100. Patreon Selects: Is Good Therapy Just the Absence of Bad Therapy?
Carrie and Ben are joined by Dr. Will Dobud to discuss two burning questions: is good therapy just the absence of bad therapy, and should we ban the use of cognitive behavioral therapy? We explore the importance of teaching people...

What's Very Bad Therapy about?

Download our free app to listen on your phone

Very Bad Therapy episodes:

147. Termination Session

146. Patreon Selects: Carrie-Ben Therapy (aka CBT 2.0)

145. Patreon Selects: Book Review - All Therapy Books

144. The Shrink Next State

143. Patreon Selects: Fun With the Psychology Today Profile Generator

142. VBT Study Hall: Client Testimonials and Reviews

141. “Not All Christians…” (with Josh Foster, LCPC)

140. VBT Study Hall: What Does “Trauma-Informed” Mean?

139. Politics in the Therapy Room (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)

138. Patreon Selects: Is EMDR a Cultish Pyramid Scheme?

137. VBT Study Hall: Evaluating Research

136. Very Bad Group Therapy

135. VBT Study Hall: Treatment Planning

134. Neurodiversity and Diagnosis (with Halina Brooke, LAMFT)

133. VBT Study Hall: Termination

132. Some Bad Parts (with Dr. Sheila Addison)

131. VBT Study Hall: First Sessions

130. Gambling Therapy

129. Patreon Selects: Will Carrie Ever Get Licensed?

128. VBT Study Hall: The Therapeutic Alliance

127. Enlightenment is Not a Treatment Goal (with Dr. Jim Jobin)

126. VBT Study Hall: Interventions

125. So You’ve Stereotyped Your Client (with Deanna Fierman, LPC)

124. VBT Study Hall: Theoretical Orientations

Bonus: Clinical Licensing Exams Don't Work (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)

123. Catching Feelings (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)

122. Patreon Selects: Degrees of Confusion (Part II)

121. Patreon Selects: Degrees of Confusion (Part I)

120. Hard Conversations

119. Patreon Selects: The Intersections of Philosophy and Psychotherapy

118. Testing Patients (with Rachel Simon, LCSW)

117. Patreon Selects: The History of Expertise in Therapy (Part II)

116. Patreon Selects: The History of Expertise in Therapy (Part I)

115. What is Bad Therapy, and Who Gets to Provide It? (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)

114. Patreon Selects: An Actor, a Sommelier, and a Poker Player Walk Into a Bar

113. Psychedelics and Therapy (with Ben Hearn, LPCC-S)

112. Patreon Selects: Desperate Remedies for Mental Illness

111. Talking About Antisemitism (with Halina Brooke, LAMFT)

110. Patreon Selects: The VBT Guide to Grad School (Part II)

109. Patreon Selects: The VBT Guide to Grad School (Part I)

108. The Inevitable CBT Episode (with Alyssa Davis, LMFT)

Bonus: Introducing the Learn Psychotherapy Podcast

107. Patreon Selects: Ask Us Anything!

106. Psycho, Education

105. Patreon Selects: The Elephant in the Therapy Room

104. Crises in the Time of Intake (with Dr. Ben Caldwell)

103. Patreon Selects: The Therapists’ Side of the Story

102. The Good and Bad of Dialectical Behavior Therapy (with Fred Kutnick, LCSW)

101. Bonus: Hollywood and Mental Health (with Thomas Lennon)

100. Patreon Selects: Is Good Therapy Just the Absence of Bad Therapy?