My guest is Tom Sarrouf from the Intercollegiate Studies Institute in the US, an educational institution devoted to educating future leaders for liberty.

Tom’s a proponent of postliberalism, and with liberalism seemingly failing, there's been fruitful contributions from some Christian postliberals. Whether they can create a coherent program and shift the culture is another question.

As you’ll see in this episode, I’m still working through these issues and wouldn't classify myself as a postliberal, but Tom does a great job of laying things out.

We discuss the educating of a new elite that can set America back on course, whether America is a democracy, the deep state, the true dividing line in the US, liberalism vs postliberalism, being educated vs being informed, new coalitions, and Croatia as a demonstration of some postliberal values.

It was a pleasure talking with Tom. Stay tuned for a counter perspective in the near future.

(00:00) Introduction

(00:13) ISI’s purpose

(06:44) The broader counter-establishment educational ecosystem

(11:59) Educating an alternate elite

(16:45) The feeling on the street

(21:08) An institutional success story? The Federalist Society

(24:06) Being educated vs being informed

(32:59) Is the US a democracy?

(39:06) Is the real divide establishment vs anti-establishment?

(44:46) Liberalism

(49:14) Postliberalism

(53:42) Digging deeper on postliberalism

(59:00) A more optimistic view of people than classical liberalism?

(1:04:38) A few pushbacks

(1:10:25) Prudential judgement vs ideology in economics

(1:20:31) Croatia, liberalism as separation, and urban planning

(1:27:49) Building new, authentic coalitions

(1:32:07) Wrapping up