Since appearing on his podcast, he and I have become friends. You can't hear it in this recording, but since meeting on line, I've met him in San Diego, where I stayed in his guest bedroom, meet his family, and cooked my famous no-packaging vegetable stew together.

So this episode is more personal.

Jared has acted more than most to live by his environmental values, so you'll get to hear someone not complaining. You get to hear people who have acted sharing our experiences. If you haven't acted and mean to, you'll hear that from other side. We don't complain, though we wonder why people don't act.

To me this was an open, honest conversation among people who are making meaningful changes in their lives and enjoying it. The leadership part of this podcast is about that joy, as well as meaning, value, importance, and purpose.

I hope this conversation showed that you'll enjoy changing when it's to live by your values and you'll wish you had earlier. Yes, you'll stop doing some things you are. Think of great historical change -- civil rights, slavery, and so on. People who made big changes are glad they did.

Incidentally, Jared introduced me to people who held an event where I spoke on leadership and the environment while cooking my famous no-packaging vegetable stew for 50 people

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