In the week that the World Social Enterprise Forum comes to Edinburgh, we talk to Laurence Demarco, who has played a key role in making Scotland a hub of social innovation. The co-founder of Senscot, which connects and supports social entrepreneurs across Scotland, he has dedicated his career to community development and local empowerment - which is how he and Mel met, back in the 1980s!

In their conversation, Laurence and Mel talk cover a lot of ground: local empowerment, a mutual economy that serves everyone, a maximum wage, the ideal country size and how older people have a valuable contribution to make to a new economic system.