Phil Lietz is the owner of Arids Only, a Uromastyx breeding facility in the US. In this episode, Phil discusses why he has decided to reduce the number of uromastyx species he is working with, the concept of "endurance" and what it means as a herpetoculturalist, and how to interpret selling photos from breeders. The second half of this episode revolves around the "naturalistic fallacy", We discuss why replicating nature for your captive reptile is not always the correct thing to do and in some cases why it can be a mistake.

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