Today we have a special guest, Michael Santos. You’re used to usually hearing from somebody who’s some corporate executive, or outstanding entrepreneur, and that is one nice story that we hear a lot. But this is somebody who has come over what I would like to say insurmountable, but he overcame the odds, and has really been an inspiration and works to be an inspiration for others. He had been in prison for I believe it was 26 years, Michael?

Michael: That is correct, 26 calendar years.

Thomas: Wow. The way you say that, I’m sure it made a striking impression. He’s taken that, what he learned, and what he did during that time, and is using that to try to help other people who are in similar situations. You’ve heard me talk often about overcoming or breaking through the odds, etc. This is probably one of the most unique circumstances. One, when listening to this, should be thinking: “Dang, I know I can do what I plan on doing.”

Michael, tell us a little bit more about that story.

Michael: I was a young man who was misdirected. Made a lot of bad decisions, following a really reckless transition from adolescence into adulthood. I think it was around 1985, I saw this movie Scarface and was influenced in the worst possible way, thinking it would be a really exciting way to live. I moved from my home in North Seattle to South Florida in Miami, and began trafficking and cocaine. Really a lack of understanding of the criminal justice system resulted in me deluding myself into believing that if I didn’t actually handle the cocaine, I wouldn’t be breaking the law, so I coopted a group of friends from high school. We were all in our early 20s. I think we were 20. I coopted them into the scheme, and they began transporting the cocaine back to Seattle; from Miami to Seattle.

That lasted for about 18 months until my friends started getting caught, and rather than wanting to face the lengthy sentences that were awaiting them during that dawn on the war on drugs, they began cooperating with authorities. And, as a consequence, I was arrested. Although there wasn’t any weapons involved or violence in our particular case, the charge that I face exposed me to a very long sentence because I was considered a leader. I was a leader, but at that time in my life, I wasn’t quite ready to accept responsibility and was just willing to accept the advice of counsel that I could beat this at trial.

I went to trial, and subsequently, I was convicted on every count. My judge sentenced me to 45 years in federal prison. That is the short version of the story.

Thomas: That is quite a story. What is interesting also about it is that you say—I’ve detected almost tongue-in-cheek—you were a leader, which of course the thing that hurt you a lot, but it’s so easily to be led. You were led by things that you saw, etc., Scarface, and other things, and how it romanticized life. It makes me wonder about a lot of the TV and stuff that goes on today. Then also, how friendships influence one another, that is your environment. Your environment, to some extent, my environment—I’m not talking about the sunshine and stuff like this—but the people around you, the social, the collective ideas and thoughts that you had as a bunch of kids talking to each other, and each confirming each other’s great idea.

Michael: Yeah, we were just young and eager to have a good time, and not really appreciating the role we had in society by engaging in the type of behavior that we were doing. We were just 20 years old, thinking that we were having fun. The reality was the law… When I said “leader,” I meant it in a legal term. What that means is the particular crime for which I was convicted was called the “Continuing Criminal Enterprise,” and there were some really strict elements that the prosecutors had to prove, and that was that the individual had to have led, or manage, or oversaw five or more people, the individual would have had to have engaged in three or more overt acts like ren...