Be sure to follow Alone with Peter on Instagram for highlight clips of the latest episodes, previews of upcoming guests, and more. Follow along, and send me a DM to let me know what you think of the show!

I actually had the privilege of being on David's podcast Expat Empire a few months ago to talk about my time living abroad. You can check that out here!

If you want to get in touch with David McNeill or learn more about what Expat Empire has to offer your move abroad check out the links below.

Website: https://expatempire.com

Podcast: https://expatempire.com/podcast-overview/

Facebook: https://facebook.com/expatempire

Instagram: https://instagram.com/expatempire

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/expatempire/

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/ExpatEmpire

*Transcripts may contain a few typos. With interviews ranging from 1-2 hours, it can be difficult to catch minor errors.

Peter Kersting: Welcome to Alone with Peter. I'm your host. And on this podcast, you're going to hear interviews with entrepreneurs, artists, digital nomads, and people seeking personal growth. We'll dive deep into what set them on their journey, where they are now, and how their story can impact you, including any helpful insights if you feel inspired to take a similar leap of faith. No matter where you are on the journey, thank you for spending some quality time Alone with Peter.

David McNeill: We're back for the third and well, hopefully not final, but the last interview for now with David McNeill, the founder of Expat Empire. Previously on Alone with Peter, we talked about David's Japanese fluency, ad nauseam, and its fascinating stuff. Linguistics always gets me going. And I think for anybody who's interested in moving to another country, especially a country with a very different language and culture, you can learn a lot from that episode and from David himself.

David McNeill: So don't forget to go back and check out that first and second interview if you have not already, but right now we're going to talk about Expat Empire. We're gonna talk about what that is, who that applies to, and how David's attitude of saying yes to opportunity and being open to pivoting has led to his success in this business opportunity.

David McNeill: You're not gonna wanna miss out. At the end of this episode, we're going to be giving you some actionable, practical tips if you're interested in living abroad, working abroad, being out there, and seeing what the world has to offer. So stay tuned for that. All right, David are you ready, man? How's it going?

David McNeill: It's going very well. Yeah, I'm definitely ready. Love to talk about all these topics. It's near and dear to my heart, obviously, and share as much insight, knowledge, and advice as I can.

David McNeill: Yes, yes, yes. Okay. So first I'm gonna start with this question. How important has it been for you to learn to pivot and just take the lemons life gives you?

David McNeill: Unbelievably important. And I think it's probably, I would venture that listeners of this, or viewers of this episode and these past episodes would maybe look at my experience or the things that I've done and say, wow, everything worked out great or you know, this or that.

David McNeill: I'm very fortunate that it has in the big picture, but, I have gone over quite a tough road over the years. You know, my plan, as we talked about last time was to stay in Japan. At least initially, that was what I wanted to do. That was my big passion. I finally got there and it ended up only being an experience of two years, which is not the shortest, but it's also not the longest time. And that was again because I applied to 50 jobs there.

David McNeill: I did not end up getting the one that sort of worked out or that made sense for me and my career. And so I decided okay, time to move countries, languages, and cultures for an opportunity in Germany and Berlin. And so that's just one example, but you know, I've gone through something like six jobs in seven years. So I had, I mean we can get into it, but I had that. I had a job in finance, originally. I left that after a couple years, then I worked in San Francisco for, a tech company for a year. Got laid off from that, after coming back from China, which we talked about, then I went to Japan, worked there for two years and ultimately had to make the decision to move on. And then I worked three different jobs in Berlin in the three years that I was there and then came to Portugal for a new opportunity and got laid off a year after that.

David McNeill: So, you know, it's definitely been a lot of ups and downs. It's not always been fun, but it has worked out in the big picture. And I guess that's the thing about it is that it makes me realize that I can adjust. I can always pivot. I can change what I'm doing, what I'm focused on in the country, the culture, and everything else to make it work for me. But, it's not been an easy road and I don't want to have anyone come away from this thinking that, you know, stuff has just fallen into my lap. It's been a lot of work and a lot of disappointment and frustration along the way, but I've just kept that goal of staying abroad doing what I want to do, and continuing my career and the path that it takes to keep me going,

Peter Kersting: David, thank you so much for being honest with the audience, because I think, especially in today's world, we're getting these snapshots. We get snapshots of people's success, snapshots of their Instagram stories. And we forget that we're seeing this at 500 times speed. We joked about this in-between episodes that when you see somebody's road trip, you're not seeing all the stress and the sleep deprivation, and arguing with your friend, cuz he is backseat driving. You're just getting the highlights. Of course, that looks like a great life. And for you to be honest with us that, Hey, you know what? Yeah. I spent 15 years studying Japanese. I thought I was gonna be in Japan for a long time. This was the plan. And then it's just two years and I had to pivot? I'm sure at the time that was so disappointing and so hard for you.

David McNeill: Oh yeah. I remember how angry I was at Japan. Let's say like as a concept, like, I had sacrificed and invested so much for it. And that's what I got in return? That's how I felt. You know, you get rosier glasses as time goes on and things like that. And I mean, it is what it is. And obviously, I've been down the path I was supposed to be on. I don't regret it for an instant and you know, ultimately now I have my wife, who's Japanese and we speak Japanese at home, so you know, some people would say…

Peter Kersting: Hold the phone!

David McNeill: Haha, yeah.

Peter Kersting: Okay. First of all, I didn't even know until, two interviews ago that you're married for the last two years, but second of all, your wife's Japanese, that is… Okay. So anybody who's listening, stop jogging, park your car real quick. And just think about this for a second. Okay? This guy spent 15 years of his life studying Japanese, becoming fluent in Japanese, learning about the culture, and appreciating the culture. And there was value in that in and of itself by itself. Okay. That's, that's very important to remember this. It was passion that taught him to do that. Second of all, he went to Japan. It wasn't what he wanted it to be. And I don't mean that as the experience wasn't worthwhile, but it didn't last as long as he wanted it to. The job market didn't work for him the way he hoped that it would.

Peter Kersting: And he had to pivot and move on and you can look at that and say, that was a failure. And yet, hold on a second, you don't meet your wife if you don't go to Japan. If you don't study Japanese, you don't go to Japan. If you don't go to Japan, you don't end up in Berlin. If you don't end up in Berlin, you don't meet your wife. So for anybody, who's trying to wonder if the effort they put into something is worthwhile or not just shut up and think about that for a second. I love that.

David McNeill: Yeah. Thank you. And I, I feel lucky and fortunate, and all of those types of words. Whatever the right word is for how it's worked out. But I think maybe the key takeaway is not oh, you might find your soulmate from that, but more that at the end of the day, you don't know how these things are going to go. And then, I mean, as, I don't know, as I've kind of thought about it as I've learned, and as I've read, to be honest, it's this idea of, you need to know the what and the why, but you can't know the how. The how just happens. So for me, it was many things in life, but, what is, I want to go to Japan. Why? Because I love the culture. I love blah, blah, blah. You know, all that stuff. How? I have absolutely no idea, but I'm gonna try to figure it out.

David McNeill: And you know, one thing eventually leads to another. It may take longer than you expect, but it happened. And then subsequently with Germany, subsequently with Portugal, subsequently with the business. I've seen it happen time and time again in my life. It's hard for me to give up that sense of control, but there is a level of that that I think we have to do because, well, I'm not trying to get too spiritual and I'm not religious, but I will say there's, there's a strange way that these things tend to work out one way or another, for reasons that are outside of my understanding. I can leave it at that, but it's like you said, how would I have had any idea that I would end up meeting my wife in Berlin, a Japanese person, and then, you know, be able to continue using the language…And people love to say, oh, you have a Japanese wife. That must be why you're so good at Japanese. I have to tell 'em no, I studied my ass off to make it happen.

Peter Kersting: It's another one of those typecasts.

David McNeill: It's one of those things where, at least for me, it's important for people to know that I put in the work and I've been able to reap the benefits over time, but it's never been clear how it all comes together.

Peter Kersting: And yet at the same time when somebody just goes, "oh, you were successful because of blah, blah, blah." Or, "oh, you know, Japanese cuz of blah, blah, blah." You just gotta let that person think what they're gonna think. You know what I mean? It's like when you just go, "Yeah. I'm from California" and they go, "oh, lalalalala." And you're like, "yeah, I'm not gonna correct you. That's, sure. Yes. That's exactly right. Thank you. Now let's move on to a different conversation."

David McNeill: Yeah. You have to pick your battles. Yeah.

Peter Kersting: So we talked about it, how dangerous it is to just go snapshot, snapshot, snapshot. This is life and their life is so much better than mine and they're so much more successful or whatever. Or it's easy for them. That is the wrong way to see things because we're only seeing... even in this podcast, we're only seeing some of the highlights, and yet at the same time, being able to step out macro and go, oh wow. That led to that led to that led to that. I don't know.

Peter Kersting: I hope that this is kind of a little bit of an exploration for you as well to be like, oh wow. Yeah. My life has a direction and I have control over that direction yet. I don't know the details. I love what you said about that. I always think of this