James and Shawn have Andrew Crider on the podcast again to talk about leadership.

This is the bootleg version with all of our banter and other stuff that normally gets cut out of the main episode. We thought it may be fun for you to hear a bit of what goes on behind the scenes.

*Note: There are no show notes on this version, but they will be on the edited episode. I may get them uploaded here a bit later, also.