In this conversation, Nick and John discuss the difference between a press and a publisher, as well as John's recent Kickstarter failures and his upcoming project, Overgrowth. They also talk about the importance of marketing and creating an engaging project page on Kickstarter. Nick discusses his plans to create a regular deck of playing cards and launch a Kickstarter project. He shares the pricing details and discounts for backers. John talks about the importance of budgeting in publishing and the costs involved in editing, layout, and cover design. They also discuss the timing of querying agents and the importance of presentation in book pitches. John advises against using AI audiobook channels and emphasizes the benefits of working with human narrators. They also touch on the choice between self-publishing and working with a publisher like Podium for audiobooks. In this part of the conversation, John discusses the pros and cons of using a platform like Podium for self-publishing an audiobook. He emphasizes the importance of owning your work and highlights the benefits of self-publishing. They also discuss how to support a self-published author as a significant other, including providing feedback, leaving reviews, and promoting their work on social media. The conversation then shifts to cover design, with John recommending finding reputable cover artists and creating a price list. They also caution against working with predatory publishers and share resources to identify reputable publishers. The conversation concludes with a reminder to review books and support artists.