All around the world, governments are coming up with new technologies to control and monitor the spread of the coronavirus. Controlling the spread of the covid has created an ever expanding demand for data on citizens. What does this mean for democracy and civil liberties? Does this need for data mean a shrinkage of individual rights? Are we witnessing the same rise of state control as after 9/11? Our guest is Matt Longo. Matt is the author of the Politics of Borders (Cambridge University Press). Matt has written extensively on borders, security and human rights after 9/11.