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How often have you complained about the homogeneity of panels at conferences; teams at client pitches; leadership teams in organisations? My personal experiences over the past decade have strengthened my belief that it is not just important to have representation, equally important is visibility. Visibility that can help to create recognition about diverse leadership and make it the norm rather than the exception. So, I committed to spotlighting and showcasing women leaders from across geographies, leaders who transcend barriers of race, ethnicity, religion, socio-economic, disability, neurodiversity on The Elephant in the Room podcast. And also explore the evolving definition and what it means to different people. 

Sophie Standke, International Diversity & Inclusion Lead, Beam Suntory is one such leader, passionate about helping create a more inclusive and equitable organisation. In this episode we spoke about 

👉🏾 About being stuck, lack of progress and the realisation that not everyone had access to the same opportunities

👉🏾 Recognition that there are different realities, being heard and being taken seriously

👉🏾 Strategies to dealing with the imposter syndrome, fitting in and the importance of values match

👉🏾 Passion and purpose, leadership mindset, changing the leadership paradigm 

👉🏾 Leading in a post pandemic world with flexibility and empathy

👉🏾 The importance of acknowledging the systemic barriers and meeting people where they are, rather than a one size fits all solution

👉🏾 Building an inclusive culture where everyone can thrive

“I think being genuinely valued and respected involves more than just being included or feel like you're fitting in. It really involves the power to help set the agenda to help make decisions on how and what work is being done and to have your interests being taken into account. And then in the end, being recognised, for your contributions and being given opportunities to advance. And that's when you see you're actually welcomed in an organisation.”

Who are the leaders you admire and would like to spotlight?

Shownotes

Memorable passages from the episode

👉🏾 Thank you so much. Thank you for inviting me Sudha, it's my pleasure and I'm very excited to be speaking with you today. 

👉🏾 Well, I grew up in Germany and in East Berlin. So growing up, I always felt a sense of division actually in my own country and even felt that after the wall came down. I always was curious though about what was happening outside of Germany, what was happening in the world. Because I never felt a true sense of belonging, I always felt a bit different.

👉🏾 For example, I don't really identify myself or limit myself to just one country; instead, I'm more curious about what can I learn from other cultures. So for me, it was very clear actually at a very early age that I wanted to have a deeper experience and enjoy the complexities of life that you get from other countries and other cultures. And I had the opportunity to attend an international school in Germany, where classes were taught in English and where I met many students from around the world. And then right after school, right after I passed my A-levels, I actually spent seven months in France where I worked at the bar and I learned French and it was the first time I worked and lived and surrounded by a different language. And I really had one of my most enriching moments there, I have to say. I then came back to Germany and I went on to study languages and business administration, not really knowing what I wanted to do, but I was always guided by my curiosity to experience different cultures.

👉🏾 So what I did, I applied for many different jobs all over the world, and I finally got the opportunity to go to London, where I then started my career in FMCG marketing. And then five years ago, I joined in London, also Beam Suntory, which is a global premium spirits company. I joined them in the marketing department, and then three years ago, I moved to Madrid with Beam Suntory to the European head office. So yeah, that is pretty much my journey so far. 

👉🏾 Exactly. Now I'm leading Diversity, Equity & Inclusion for Beam Suntory international and well I have to tell you, I've never planned to become a DE & I professional. In fact, when I started my career, I didn't even know that it was a job and I also didn't even know that one day I would care so deeply about it, right? So what happened was that three years ago, Beam Suntory was looking for D&I volunteers, to really build out the foundations of their D&I journey. And also first of all create awareness for their D&I efforts and their ambitions. And at the time I was sort of not really knowing a lot about D&I, but it really resonated with me because I was at the point in my career where I was sort of stuck. I didn't really progress and at the same time I noticed that not everyone had the same opportunities, but that certain people clearly benefited differently from resources, promotion opportunities or development opportunities, while others really didn't in the same way and I wasn't really sure why I didn't know why. So I put my hand up for leading the first women in leadership employee group and I started to speak and connect with many women in the business and it turned out that we all had a very similar experience and that we all faced very similar feelings in terms of the barriers that we faced.

👉🏾 So I started to run a really in-depth gender assessment to make those challenges that women faced real and to put almost an insight on it versus just a feeling, if that makes sense. And that's when I again quickly realised that there are systemic barriers in place in organisations that affect any minority group, not just women. So I really wanted to contribute my time to help with an equitable organisation on all levels beyond gender and that's really the point when I decided that I wanted to change my career from marketing to become a full-time D&I professional. And it has been, not easy I have to say, now when I talk about it, it sounds like an easy journey. But it took a lot of reflection, a lot of speaking to a lot of different people, but in the end, I'm very lucky that Beam career transition, so to speak, happen for me and that they gave me the opportunity to lead D&I internationally. So that's how it came about. 

👉🏾 Great question. Well, so first of all Sudha, I have to say, I guess I'm a bit of a work in progress and I do still face many challenges, right? As well as opportunities to learn and progress from, obviously. But one of the barriers I faced was the barrier to progress really, which showed up in a way that the path to progression was not transparent to me and that opportunities for progression were also not shared with everybody. So again, that's when I realised that there are people that are favoured over others and that there are different rules and resources for different people and that there are also unsaid rules that not everybody learns. And so many of us might agree that all humans are equal and should have the same opportunities, yet we can't, or we don't see the obstacles that others face because it doesn't really happen to everyone. Which leads me to another challenge that I faced, which is to speak up openly about those challenges that I faced, but also to give a voice to the barriers that other employees faced, which is now part of the role I am in now. 

👉🏾 And here actually the challenge was not to speak up, but the challenge was to be heard, to be understood and to be taken seriously by people of privilege, that don't even understand because they benefit from the way things are done. And the way things are done, is normal or it's seen as normal. So realities are very different for people, and I guess what I'm trying to say is that organisations need to be ready to hear different realities and people who speak up, like this example, like for me. I was always very open and I probably burned a few bridges here and there, and the people who speak up also need to be mindful of when they craft their message, where is the organisations at, because it can backfire, and that is definitely something that also happened to me. So I guess now part of my D&I journey and also part of my job obviously, is to make sure that we set the rules and conditions that work for everybody, not only for a few. But also to make sure that the systemic barriers are visible, that they are seen as real problems to overcome versus isolated incidences. 

👉🏾 Yes, of course, I have, as you say I think it's a very human emotion, I think everybody has probably felt this at some point in their lives. This feeling of...... like we're not good enough or we lack confidence and I think it's a very common feeling first of all, in men and women. And imposter also can show up in different intensity levels, from feeling almost incapable or feeling like a fraud in your job to just feeling a lack of confidence in certain situations. And I definitely had experiences of not feeling good enough, for example, when I moved into D&I without any background of HR. So that said, I think it's important to always reflect and understand why do those feelings occur and then replace them with a motivating or positive thought so I always approach this with a growth mindset and also with my individual journey, because everybody has their own individual journey and we're never perfect.

👉🏾 And it doesn't make sense to also compare yourself to others. So I also always go by the mantra, feel the fear or feel the emotion, but do it anyway and continuously expose yourself to those situations that you might feel uncomfortable about. Because for me, that has been the only way to really learn and grow and also learn to understand that I can do it.

👉🏾 So this feeling of, oh maybe I can't, turns into something I can. So I think imposter is probably something that everybody has, and it's not just one thing. It probably happens over course of life, it comes up in different phases and it's easier said than done to navigate this. But I think I see it as a daily practice, I do really take care of what do I think, what are my thoughts and what do I choose to think daily, and how do I let emotions affect me. So, it’s like a daily practice to manage this, but I think it becomes a problem if imposter hinders your progression. 

👉🏾 Yeah well I have to say no, I didn't feel pressure to fit in and the reason is pretty much because I'm very comfortable and confident about who I am and the value I bring. However, I do feel or sense when I don't fit in, obviously. It's a very uncomfortable feeling. And I also think that fitting in again, is a spectrum from feeling slightly different or excluded and again maybe certain moments, or in situations where you feel like you're truly excluded, you're like constantly feeling a mismatch with your values. And in my view, it becomes a challenge when there's no room for difference, when there is no room to show up in the way we want to show up and to be welcomed in this way. 

👉🏾 So I think organisations that adopt an attitude of learning and openness and willingness to consider and implement the ideas of others, or just take on board the way they are. And this will really enable them and enable their workforce, but also retain their workforce and just make them more happier and more engaged and that is what research shows. And I think being genuinely valued and respected involves more than just being included or feel like you're fitting in. It really involves the power to help set the agenda to help make decisions on how and what work is being done and to have your interests being taken into account. And then in the end, being recognised, for your contributions and being given opportunities to advance. And that's when you see you're actually welcomed in an organisation. So I think those moments of not fitting in do exist, like the moments of imposter. But if it becomes really a permanent feeling that affects your wellbeing, then I think everybody needs to think about whether they're in your right space. 

👉🏾 Yes, I did. I think I probably had many mistakes because I'm also very critical of myself. I think I alluded to this in my earlier response in terms of speaking up. So I consider myself to be the voice of the employees and I feel very okay speaking up about things that people perceive and be a voice for them. And what happened is that I probably chose times, when I spoke up, but not in a right way, using the right words, bringing people properly on the journey, knowing the people I talk to, right? Knowing your audience. So I think that goes back to the learning around, first of all, building your relationships and thinking about how, if you have a crucial conversation, or if you have things that you want to talk about, that are not easy, that might create contradiction or conflict, you need to prepare. And I think I was a bit, maybe naive, rushing in there, believing in good intent, believing, oh, everybody will just feel like I did or I do. So that was probably one of my biggest learnings. I think it was good mistakes, cause you only learn through that. 

👉🏾 Yes, I do. I really think the beauty of humanity lies in the complexity and diversity of all of us and I do believe that everybody has their own personal path in this world and with that a unique purpose to fulfil. In my experience, a personal purpose cannot always be identified intellectually necessarily, it really comes from the heart and it's something that we deeply care about, which is intertwined with our values. So for example, I found my personal purpose really with the D&I work but it started as a passion project until I realised it is linked to my values. And until I realised I really deeply care about it and I want to build up expertise, and that I also really enjoyed the work and its challenges, obviously. We just spoke about a few of them. But that said not every passion for example is our purpose, that's why we need to differentiate, and passions sometimes can be a good indication as to where does your energy lead you, but we have many passions, but not everything is our purpose. 

👉🏾 Leadership to me is, first and foremost, a mindset, which is then reflected in our daily behaviours and which then also has an impact, a meaningful impact, ideally on the people around you and the businesses. I think about leadership by asking myself three questions, maybe to help; so first of all, do we create opportunities or do we wait for direction? Are we part of the solution or are we part of the problem? Do we have a growth mindset to continuously learn, reflect, and most importantly, support others in the way they want to be supported and include everybody? Do we create safe spaces, or do we lead by fear? And I think great leadership, if those questions are answered in the right way, can be really an engine for doing great things, for unlocking opportunities and potential in people, in businesses. And really can be a force for good that can steer and motivate teams towards like a common goal and this can be big or small, and everybody can be a leader because it's a mindset, it is not a role, it's a mindset. And I think the final thing there, I want to say because we're also having a D&I conversation is that, great leaders come in different shapes and forms. They come from different backgrounds and organisations can move from homogeneous leadership to more diverse leadership, which will take time and preparation and safe spaces. But leadership really shows up and comes in all shapes and forms. 

👉🏾 Great question, in my personal view right now, I think the two main ingredients are flexibility and empathy. Flexibility in terms of how we lead people across all levels. So leading across geography really requires a great deal of empathy, understanding and awareness of how different cultures and teams prefer to interact.

👉🏾 So for example, Erin Myer's book which is called a Cultural Map, I don't know if you know this, is a great read to really educate yourself about the very different nuances and preferences. So leaders can really learn to flex their styles and lean into the situation and lean into the teams they're working with. And to me this is similar when it comes to hybrid working. So especially in the current pandemic and people coming back to work, research shows that men are more likely to return to their office, compared to women, obviously, because of their caregiving responsibilities mainly, so they prefer to work from home. And the other insight, which is interesting there, is that 64% of managers believe that office workers are higher performers than remote workers, which leads me to a very common bias, which is called proximity bias, right? Which is the idea, that employees with close physical proximity to their team or company leaders, would be perceived again, as better workers, as better performers, and this can lead to favouritism. So going back to flexibility, I really do believe that everybody, especially women, should be given the flexibility to work in a way that helps them to do their job the best possible way. And going back to flexibility, but also empathy, I think what is important is that managers have conversations with their teams, with their individual employees, and really try to understand what is it that they need, like ask and listen. Don't assume, what is it that they need in their work environment, in their personal life, what is going on for them, and then be really flexible to accommodate their needs.

👉🏾 And the insight here again is that organisations that offer employees this full-time flexibility over when, where, and how much they work. They actually see 55% of their workforce is high performers. So it's really moving to enablement, empowering people because every person knows best, what works best for them and having the trust. 

👉🏾 Yes. Well that's probably one of my favourite questions Sudha but I think going back to what we mentioned in the beginning, I think the first step to really enable women is to acknowledge that the barriers that women face are real. It's not isolated incidences; there is systemic bias, there is systemic barriers and research shows that those gender bias shows up in those critical moments, be it in promotion or hiring decisions, be it in talent reviews or those daily micro-moments. For example, who is being heard in meetings, whose contribution matters, who gets opportunities versus who doesn't. So that is really the most important step and...