Vince and Jo continue their conversation with special guest Francis Chan, this week answering the question, "Why can't I get rid of shame, even when the shame is brought on by something I can't control?"

Francis Chan is a father, grandfather, pastor, and author of several bestselling books, the most recent of which is Letters to the Church. You can find out more about his work at www.wearechurch.com and www.crazylove.org.

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