Daniel Gomez Gaviria, Vice Minister of Planning in Colombia, tells us about the unprecedented expansion of Colombia's social welfare programmes (powered by the SISBEN information system), and how it is reaching out to the hardest-to-reach — including those without bank accounts. We also hear an uncommon perspective on global trade and supply chains that runs counter to what many other countries are doing and how the pandemic might affect Colombia’s meeting culture long after it has subsided. This conversation was recorded May 15, 2020.