In Episode 65 of PennSound podcasts, Wendy Trevino joined hosts Levi Bentley and Ted Rees for this PennSound podcast, the first in a series of intimate conversations in Housework's transition from reading series to recording series. Conversation topics included Barack Obama's appearance in Best Experimental Writing 2016, post-arrest listmaking, "unequal collateral," the organizing-specific shifts of self, acknowledging messy comrade conflict, and further associations drawn from Trevino's 2018 collection Cruel Fiction.