As much as the world has judged churches, spoiler alert: Jesus also judges churches. How?

Pastor Mike and Amber Albee Swenson—one of our Time of Grace bloggers, podcasters, and writers—dive into the next TV message series that takes a look at Jesus' letters to the first-century churches in the book of Revelation. Somehow in their discussion of issues churches deal with today (boring churches, loving churches, suffering, and sexual morality), Pastor Mike and Amber manage to weave in topics of Pastor Mike's questionable new European jacket, how Amber has texted her pastor in the middle of a hymn, and a condom story. 😬

We also get a sneak peek at Pastor Mike's new book, "What's Big Starts Small." It comes out June 14, but you can preorder yours today on Amazon.

Pastor Mike and Amber also mention this month's new book by Pastor Mike and the team of pastors he serves with called "Letters From Jesus." Get this new book at timeofgrace.org with your gift to the ministry.