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Best Evidence for Alien Presence on Earth
Despite recent government efforts to characterize US Navy UFO footage as products of a government disinformation campaign to distract from actual top-secret military aircraft projects, an abundance of encounters of various types show not only that aliens are behind many UFOs but that deep-black contractors are in possession of alien craft and alien "biologics" for reverse engineering efforts.
Transcript
Tom Kagy (00:02)
Hello, this is Tom Kagy with Unconventional Wisdom. Today we have Najla Zaidi, who will be our expert on the strongest evidence that we have of an alien presence here on Earth. Hello, Najla, how are you?
Najla Zaidi (00:20)
I'm good, Tom. Thank you for having me again. This is an exciting topic to talk about.
Tom Kagy (00:24)
Yes, I love the topic. think it's probably one of the most interesting topics that a human being can contemplate. OK, so now recently we've seen articles suggesting that, you know, some of the ⁓ UFO evidence that had been released by the New York Times, you know, namely the Tic Tac video and the ⁓ gimbal video, that these were.
Najla Zaidi (00:32)
Exactly.
Tom Kagy (00:52)
Somehow, I'm not sure they actually explained how, but they tried to suggest that these were deliberate disinformation releases by the US government and that they're not really ⁓ footage of an encounter with UFOs. Now, I don't believe that, ⁓ but…
Najla Zaidi (01:11)
Yes.
Tom Kagy (01:16)
even if that were the case, even if somehow they managed to defy the laws of physics and create these devices that were zipping around these naval pilots, even then I would say, well, even if you manage to do that, how do you explain all this other stuff that we've accumulated over the centuries and the millennia?
⁓ So today you're going to be telling us, I understand, about some of the strongest evidence that we have that we actually have been visited and in fact they're probably being visited constantly by UFOs.
Najla Zaidi (01:52)
And yes, we actually have been and there's just evidence that goes all the way back to 865 that we've been visited. And I believe personally that the reason why not only our government, but all the world's governments are not talking about this and are doing disinformation campaigns is to protect us because they're afraid too. They don't know, you know, how to deal with something outside of us.
Tom Kagy (02:20)
So they're afraid that we're going to all flip out and act like the people in the War of the Worlds episode ⁓ based on that fake radio broadcast. Is that what you're saying?
Najla Zaidi (02:30)
Exactly.
Yes, exactly, because this is something that, you know, from what our understanding is, they have technology that we don't understand and we're not even close to. So that's frightening in itself.
Tom Kagy (02:45)
Okay, that doesn't frighten me, frankly, because the way I look at it is if they're that advanced, they must have developed some sort of an ethical sensibility because you can't have a civilization becoming highly advanced without destroying itself unless they also develop a very strong ethical sensibility, essentially not going around destroying creatures for no reason.
Najla Zaidi (03:13)
I absolutely
agree with you on that. And from all the accounts that we've had, I would say the majority, 95%, have been benign. And they're just trying to learn about us. And only, as we discussed before, there were only a few accounts where it was hostile.
Tom Kagy (03:33)
Okay, yeah, so we did discuss that. right, Najla, tell us ⁓ what is the strongest evidence that you can think of? I mean, obviously it doesn't have to be in sequence because, you know, who can rate how strong a piece of evidence is? What's the strongest evidence that you can think of that would prove that aliens have been visiting us on Earth?
Najla Zaidi (03:53)
Well, I think the strongest, which everyone has seen is probably David Gersh's, who went before Congress under oath. And this is a person who is a former Air Force intelligence officer and even ex-co-lead of the UAP task force. And he came forward as a whistleblower and said, there's things going on that Congress is not aware of and the people are not aware of.
Tom Kagy (04:18)
Okay, so what were the things that he thought that should be brought to the attention of Congress and the American people?
Najla Zaidi (04:25)
Well, he basically said that he had interviewed over 40 high-end people in the military with top security clearance, which he also has, top security clearance, who had witnesses ⁓ like UAP crash retrievals. And then actually, the government, along with companies, ⁓ aerospace-type companies, had reverse engineered these programs.
Tom Kagy (04:53)
Okay, so basically he's saying that the whole ball of wax is there. mean, UFOs, aliens, alien technology actually being taken apart and used to develop projects. So what did he offer though as far as proof that what he's saying is backed up?
Najla Zaidi (05:19)
Well, the problem that he had, is because this is so high security, it's classified information, the only way that he could tell Congress would be in a classified location like a SCIF. But there were actually two…
Tom Kagy (05:35)
When
you say a skiff, explain to us what a skiff is.
Najla Zaidi (05:40)
So,
SCIF is basically a secure classified setting within the government and everyone has classified clearance in order to be in that room. And it's a room where absolutely there's no sound, there's no way that any other government or any other human being could be in on that conversation. And he was more than willing to do that with any members of Congress, but they would have to have the clearance in order.
to talk to him in that environment.
Tom Kagy (06:11)
Okay, so he was ready to name names and dates and locations, they, what happened? I mean, why didn't they go ahead and have this disclosure?
Najla Zaidi (06:22)
They are.
It is ongoing. They are talking about continually talking to him in private because the reports that he made to the intelligence community inspector general, the ICIG, he gave all the information, the names, the dates, the times, the locations in his whistleblower report. So that part of government has the information already.
Tom Kagy (06:47)
Okay, so you're saying that he has already provided information to congressional investigators, but that they can't actually talk about it to the public until it's been cleared by. Okay, okay, so.
Najla Zaidi (06:58)
Right.
The DOD, yes.
Tom Kagy (07:05)
Has there been an actual SCIF meeting in which he has detailed all of the ⁓ locations and names and projects and so forth?
Najla Zaidi (07:17)
not with Congress, there has been with the intelligence community people that he gave the information to when he filed the whistleblower claim. Because when he filed his claim, he went through the proper channels and they do have all that information, but they've not released it.
Tom Kagy (07:33)
Okay, so what,
okay, so I mean, do they have any reason why they're not making any of that public? mean, even if they don't get into particulars, it might compromise confidentiality or rather.
Najla Zaidi (07:47)
Well,
according to him, the people that have this information that are a part of this are high-end people in both in and outside of the government. So there are corporations that are also involved, and there are government officials very high up in the military. So that's why they're in charge of the material.
Tom Kagy (08:11)
Okay, so
who has been putting the kibosh on releasing this information or in at least, you know, giving some idea of what was learned at these discussions with Grush?
Najla Zaidi (08:26)
So it's basically the Pentagon and the Department of Defense because they are the ones that don't want this information to get out and they've been evading. They've been using like a particular, ⁓ it escapes me the exact name of the government document, but they're using this in order to not tell, basically not report to Congress what they're doing.
And every year, like the Department of Defense's budget is classified. So Congress has no access to it. So part of this budget is what Gersh is saying is used for this kind of technology with corporations and giving the technology to corporations to secretly work on it. So the money's coming in from the DOD budget and also from private corporations.
Tom Kagy (09:20)
Okay, so the reason they're able to keep it this confidential is that the actual details of the projects are in the hands of these deep black corporations, these deep black contractors with the defense firm.
Najla Zaidi (09:32)
Right, exactly. In
accordance with the Department of Defense.
Tom Kagy (09:38)
Okay. What about the members of the House or the Senate? mean, have they been fully cooperative with his efforts, Grush's efforts to get this information out to the public?
Najla Zaidi (09:53)
The guy,
he has not spoken to the Senate, he only spoke to the Congress and Congress has been very supportive and protective actually of him because he stated that his life, his wife's life and other people that supported him within the departments have been threatened basically as a result of him speaking out. So they are protecting him. However, in the Senate, the, ⁓
Sean Kilpatrick, he's the director and he's the director of the AARO, the Department of Defense and the Pentagon that works with the UAPs. And he, know, under oath testified to the Senate that there's no evidence of aliens. But Gersh is saying that he lied, that this is not true.
Tom Kagy (10:42)
Okay, are there any specific senators who have?
access to this information.
Najla Zaidi (10:50)
Not that I'm aware of.
Tom Kagy (10:53)
Okay, so, well, so there's this treasure trove of information that Grush is able to reveal, but only if he knows that he's not going to be sentenced to 20 years in the federal penitentiary for revealing it. otherwise, we can only take his word that there are these ⁓ programs that have possession of UFOs and alien bodies. Is that correct?
Najla Zaidi (11:21)
Yes, that's correct. At this point, we can take his word and then there were two officials within the UAP that were former officials and they both backed him up too and said that what he's saying is accurate.
Tom Kagy (11:34)
What kind of guy is Grush? mean, is he somebody that deserves to be believed?
Najla Zaidi (11:39)
Yes, absolutely. was he I actually listened to and read the entire ⁓ his entire, you know, that he made under oath in front of the House Committee. And he was logical. He was consistent. He's had an excellent reputation his entire career. He's done been in his high end. He has top secret and SCI clearance for over 14 years. And there's never been anything negative.
that he's done, as part of his job or otherwise.
Tom Kagy (12:14)
Okay. All right. Well, I guess that particular treasure trove of evidence will have to be locked up until ⁓ somebody in, I guess, in the Senate or maybe the Defense Department is willing to corroborate what he says and to reveal this information. But aside from what people have said, I mean, do we have any actual like tangible, undeniable physical evidence?
That shows that we've had advanced aliens visiting the Earth. ⁓
Najla Zaidi (12:47)
Well, like the an interesting one, which is also very recent, was the Phoenix Lights summary. The Phoenix Lights was really interesting because so many people saw it, including the governor at the time. And he said, you know, the governor, his name was Phyfe Symington, Arizona's governor. This happened in March 13th of 1997, where hundreds and hundreds of people across Arizona and even into Nevada saw
these light red and orange lights in the sky. So this was undeniable because it was caught on camera and everyone saw it including the governor.
Tom Kagy (13:24)
Okay, so there is footage of these UFOs.
Najla Zaidi (13:28)
Yes, there's actual footage and not just one person and then so many witnesses, which included private citizens and amateur astronomer with a telescope named Mitch Stanley. And then even the governor himself saw it and said that this was out, his exact words were otherworldly and bigger than anything I've ever seen before.
Tom Kagy (13:50)
Okay, so they're able to make out
some outline or shape and size.
Najla Zaidi (13:54)
Yes, they said
that it was gigantic and it was in the shape of almost like a big square floating through the sky.
Tom Kagy (14:04)
Well, still we're now, okay, we have footage, so that's two dimensions, but do we have anything that's three dimensional that would tend to prove that we've had these visitors?
Najla Zaidi (14:15)
The three-dimensional things would probably be like crop circles, which are controversial, but there's enough evidence to show that they were made by life forms that are not human.
Tom Kagy (14:27)
Okay, so what about these crop circles would make it impossible for human beings to create them?
Najla Zaidi (14:34)
Well, there's certain things about the crop circles that are unique to, I mean, there have been a lot of people that have faked them, but the real crop circles, they're always surrounded initially by somebody seeing balls of light or some kind of a, you know, UAP or UFO. And then what happens basically in a crop circle is that a formation is made and it's usually right overnight or within a few minutes or a few hours. It comes out of the blue.
And it's usually in fields of some kind of grain or cereal. And then what happens is ⁓ the crop gets flattened down. So when it's been an actual one from an alien, you know, a lot of researchers that have done this for years say the same thing. The crops are flattened. There's no breakage. There's no damage to them. And on top of it,
in the areas where inside the circle there's been radiation.
Tom Kagy (15:38)
Okay, and what about on a more microscopic level? Is there any evidence in examining the actual plants themselves that they've been…
Najla Zaidi (15:50)
Yes, there was
a study done in the 1990s by Dr. Levengood and Hasselhoff, and they basically checked the plant nodes, plants naturally have three or four nodes in them that look like knuckles, like on your fingers. And these knuckles basically not only exploded, but they grew in size from being ⁓ roughly… ⁓
like a few centimeters to up to 45 to 200 percent they elongated and Even one of the BLT this company that Leavenworth was working for was called BLT research so Nancy Talbot was one of the researchers who actually worked on the plants and she said that without a doubt there were two scientifically documented changes all over the world and they were consistent that the a pickle not
and node elongation was the first node beneath the seed head. That node became elongated and it stretched in comparison to the control nodes in the field. And it ranged from 45 to 200%. And then other ones, the cavity's holes literally blew out as if they were hit by some powerful force.
Tom Kagy (17:09)
Okay, so the changes to the nodes, the length of the nodes are things that could not be done by human beings, I assume. I mean, they didn't find this on the fake crop circles.
Najla Zaidi (17:20)
No, this is absolutely-
No, this was nothing on the fake crop circles. Plus, the fake crop circles had evidence where they were like the stocks were broken. There were proof like, you know, of footprints and these sort of things, which were not there in the actual ones. And the investigators who've been to actual, there's one in fact, her name's Linda Moulton. She's a journalist, is very respected journalist, and she's been to these crop circles, not only in England, but all over the world.
And she said, it feels different. You can see the difference, that she's done both. And in fact, one of the greatest ones was called a golden ball formation, and it formed overnight in 2005. And they have pictures from the actual, ⁓ you know, from when it actually happened. And even the flowers on top of the stocks have not been disturbed, which is not the case when it's fake.
Tom Kagy (18:17)
Okay, so now how many crop circles have they recorded?
Najla Zaidi (18:22)
There have been like over 10,000 formations from all over the world. And they've been reported in 50 different countries. And they've come from being very small to hundreds of feet across. And the other interesting thing is the real crop circles after the crops are harvested, they leave a ghost imprint that doesn't go away for a very long time.
Tom Kagy (18:43)
Okay, so the hoaxers would have had to have been very clever and extremely diligent to make these 10,000 crop circles.
Najla Zaidi (18:55)
Right, mean, plus one of the, I believe it was one of the investigators, I believe it was Charles Mallett, he's been investigating them since the 1990s. And he said that, you know, there's like a clear pattern of damage that doesn't happen, including bruising and scraping down the stems. And they use boards to crush them, they use ropes and boards to crush.
Tom Kagy (19:24)
You're talking
about the Hoxers, ⁓
Najla Zaidi (19:25)
Yes, yes, the hoaxsters. And the aliens
don't have anything like that. Plus, there's radiation.
Tom Kagy (19:32)
Are the farmers upset about these crop circles? mean, are these aliens destroying their arable land by creating these giant formations, or what's the impact that these crop circles have?
Najla Zaidi (19:41)
It's kind of
funny, the impact is that they get so much attention that none of them have ever complained about it because they get so much attention. Plus the fake circles are usually produced near where there's populations and cities, whereas the alien ones are usually in areas where there's not a population or it's more remote.
Tom Kagy (20:07)
Okay, well what about the fertility of the areas that have had the crop circles? Are the crops able to grow as well or better or worse?
Najla Zaidi (20:16)
They're growing
from within the circle where the crop circles are, the seeds that are taken from that and replanted end up growing five times faster and are five times healthier than the normal crops, which is very interesting.
Tom Kagy (20:32)
So it sounds like the aliens might be trying to help these poor farmers out.
Najla Zaidi (20:34)
I think so too. mean
whatever they're doing it's positive.
Tom Kagy (20:39)
Okay. All right. now do we have any, you mentioned that people saw ⁓ some of these crop circles actually being formed in real time. Do we have any footage or photographs showing some UFO ⁓ zipping around creating these amazing crop circles?
Najla Zaidi (20:58)
In Wiltshire, England, I was not able to find the video, but in Wiltshire, England, 1990, there were balls of light that were actually seen to lay the crops flat. And it was filmed. And that's like one of the ones that are the most famous crop circles in the world. And then like another thing too that the scientists have said that the way that the actual crop circles are formed, they contain mathematical astronom.
astronomical and scientific equations. Like one of the crop circles is an actual every turn of it is comes out to pie, you know, in science.
Tom Kagy (21:37)
Okay, so what about the ⁓ universality? mean, you're saying there are these crop circles everywhere. Are there ⁓ any signature patterns or anything that sort of seems to tie these crop circles together?
Najla Zaidi (21:58)
There's one interesting
thing that happened actually at ⁓ the Rockwell crash. There was a rock that was found at the Rockwell crash, which had an impression on it of a symbol. And it ended up that in 1996 in Chiseleden, England, that's where that image showed up in a crop circle, the exact image.
Tom Kagy (22:22)
Okay, so was it maybe somebody heard about the rock and then they faked the crop circle? I mean, is that possible?
Najla Zaidi (22:31)
It's remotely possible, but there was no connection at all. Like the rock had been found, I think it was years after the crop circle had already been there.
Tom Kagy (22:42)
Okay, so it would have had to have been a very big fluke for somebody to have planted that rock and expected it be found by somebody else.
Najla Zaidi (22:51)
Exactly. like some space astronaut theorists, believe that these crop circles are kind of like markers for aliens to know where to land and where to come. And they're leaving messages for each other and possibly for us, but we're not understanding them yet.
Tom Kagy (23:12)
Okay, aside from crop circles, do we have any other physical tangible evidence that's compelling that the aliens are visiting us now?
Najla Zaidi (23:23)
Um, there was a, and that one, like one of the earliest accounts, which is one of the most famous accounts is the Betty Barney and Betty Hill, who were actually, you know, claimed to have been abducted in back in 1961. And there was so much information that they have to this day, their niece Kathleen Mars Martin has a website and she's still
working on bringing their case to the surface and she's actually written a book recently with new evidence and there's more evidence.
Tom Kagy (23:57)
Okay, so what happened to this couple, Barney and Betty Hill?
Najla Zaidi (24:01)
So Barney and Betty Hill were driving through New Hampshire around 10, 1030 at night and they saw this bright glowing object and it appeared to be following their car.
Tom Kagy (24:13)
Okay, and then what happened?
Najla Zaidi (24:14)
And so Betty said, the way she described it, it said she first thought it was a falling star, but then the falling star started to go upwards instead of down like they normally do. And so they ended up, as they kept driving, saw that this thing was following them and they described it as a saucer shape, just exactly the way that we see it. So finally, Barney was so frightened that he even stopped, they had their dog, Delcie with them as well.
They stopped to let the dog out and at that point Barney had a gun in the trunk and he was so frightened that he even pulled out his gun and put it under his seat in the car. And so they stopped two times before they finally were actually forced to stop by this spaceship that was stopped in front of them in the woods.
Tom Kagy (25:06)
Okay, so were they taken aboard?
Najla Zaidi (25:09)
Yes, like they describe this as being kind of feeling like an out of body experience, as if they were sleepwalking. And they said that Barney actually said that as the spaceship got closer to their car, he could see, he looked up and he could see there were about 12 figures that looked non-human. And these were like, you know, as we've heard over the years, the grays, they had the big dark eyes and gray skin.
and they were basically, you know, stopped him, they, six of them came out of the ⁓ spaceship and like led them into their spaceship basically. And they both remember walking up a ⁓ kind of like a ramp into the spaceship, but then they had no memory of what happened until they ended up going to a very reputed psychiatrist at the time, Dr. Simon.
and went under hypnosis to recover those memories.
Tom Kagy (26:07)
Okay, and what were some of the memories that he managed to recover that tends to show that this was not just some hoax or some false memory?
Najla Zaidi (26:18)
So what happened was basically under hypnosis, they discovered that they were tested. Both of them were individually tested separately in separate rooms. And on Betty, they actually had torn her dress. They asked her to take off her dress, and it was like a doctor and two or three other aliens. And they couldn't do the zipper, so they tore the zipper, they tore the hem of her dress. And they did a pregnancy test where they put a needle through her navel and actually
There was on the dress, there was a blood sample that, you know, the DNA matched to be her blood. And then besides that, like she had asked them for a book, there was a book there, the way they were communicating was through telepathy. And so she talked to them and asked them where they were from. She asked them, you know, various questions like, what are you doing? And they said, we don't wanna cause you any harm. We just want to take tests. So they took finger.
fingernail samples, hair samples, skin samples.
Tom Kagy (27:21)
Okay. But aside from the ⁓ fluid that they found on her dress that suggests that she had at least been punctured there by something. And of course it could have been somebody, you know, some earthling. But aside from that, is there any other circumstantial or physical evidence that would tend to conclusively show that ⁓ she's not imagining or making this episode up?
Najla Zaidi (27:49)
Yes, there was. She had a book that she asked the leader if she could keep and he initially said yes, but then as they were sending her back to her car, he took it back. And in that book, she had seen a map and she recreated the map and years and years later, initially everyone thought she was nuts, but years and years later, it was a map of a star system.
Tom Kagy (28:13)
A map of what?
Najla Zaidi (28:18)
of where they came from. asked them where they came from. Years later, ⁓ an amateur, basically she was an amateur, her name was Marjorie Fish, and she was an amateur astronomer, but she figured this out that it was a zeta reticulite star system.
Tom Kagy (28:21)
Okay.
So in other words,
she correlated the drawing that Betty made with an actual star system that's somewhere out there.
Najla Zaidi (28:46)
Yes, yes, and it's been confirmed. Now there's some controversy on it. A few astronomers say that it's not real, but other astronomers say that it is real. So it does match up to exactly what Betty had drawn. And aside from that, in the book, the symbols that were in the book, which was the alien's language, that has been confirmed also when Betty drew those. It's been confirmed also.
that this all abductees since the 1970s are drawing the exact same symbols.
Tom Kagy (29:19)
Same symbols as where? you mean every time they're referring to that incident, the symbols were exactly the
Najla Zaidi (29:24)
Right,
every time an adepti draws symbols of what their language was or what they saw on the spacecraft, it's always exactly the same. And Betty drew the same thing.
Tom Kagy (29:38)
Was there any other like physical evidence left behind by this encounter that
Najla Zaidi (29:46)
yes, was, Barney had scuffed shoes with vegetation on his shoes. And this is from being taken into the woods, because the last thing he remembered was being on the road. And he had very like dressed, nice shiny shoes that were scuffed up and they had vegetation. He had binoculars, the strap had been torn, like cut apart basically. And then on top of that, on their car, so they had said right before they were abducted,
They were hearing these beeping noises and felt vibrations like their car was vibrating. And on the trunk of their car, there were these perfectly round, shiny spots basically. And every time they took the compass to it, the compass would go haywire because it magnetically, those circles were, you know, often magnetically charged. And so those circles didn't go away for a very long time.
Tom Kagy (30:39)
Okay, so something zapped the car and created those circles of magnetized areas.
Najla Zaidi (30:46)
Yes, and they were like perfectly round like silver dollars and extremely shiny. Even when Betty got her car washed a month or two later, the circles didn't go away. So they were there for a very long time. She said in the winter is when finally the circles went away.
INSERT AUDIO 2
Tom Kagy (00:00)
Okay. Okay, Najla. So how far away ⁓ was this Zeta or is this Zeta reticulized star system?
Najla Zaidi (00:09)
So the Zeta Reticuli star system is only 39 light years away. So it's actually, you know, not that far from us.
Tom Kagy (00:17)
Okay, so it would have been entirely possible for an amateur astronomer to be able to match the star map to an actual astronomical data.
Najla Zaidi (00:27)
Yes, and then her account, actually Marjorie Fish was brilliant, and her account was backed up by actual astronomers too. After, you know, when she went, discovered this, she contacted, I believe his name was Webb, and he was an astronomer at the time, and he backed up what she said.
Tom Kagy (00:45)
Okay, so the fact that ⁓ Betty Hill was able to draw a star map that actually accurately depicted those aliens home planet in the Zeta Reticuli system way before ⁓ our astronomers had the capability to identify these stars. So in other words, what she was drawing was information that
could only have been gotten from aliens, not from anybody on Earth.
Najla Zaidi (01:16)
Yes, absolutely, because no one on earth was aware of it at the time. And it took many years after this encounter when Marjorie Fish figured this out.
Tom Kagy (01:20)
Okay.
Okay. Okay. So let's move on to ⁓ the testimony. You had mentioned Sergeant, Master Sergeant Banks as providing some testimony ⁓ that tends to suggest that the U.S. government, you know, kind of backing up
Najla Zaidi (01:40)
Yeah, yes.
Tom Kagy (01:50)
what is that, Grush's testimony that the US government is in possession of alien hardware and what they call biologics, I guess.
Najla Zaidi (02:00)
Yes,
that's what Jason Sands says that he actually saw a spacecraft, which the government denies that it was a spacecraft, and he overheard conversation about where they were referring to alien. And then he actually had an alien encounter himself.
Tom Kagy (02:20)
Okay, so describe that encounter for us.
Najla Zaidi (02:23)
So he was driving with two other people in his Jeep or vehicle across, he was at the Air Force base at the time, he was at a military installation, and he saw this funny looking, kind of like he was running sort of funny across the, towards his car, basically, that looked almost human but not quite, this was like a bluish colored figure with large eyes, it didn't have ears.
And he also saw a small spacecraft in the distance. this alien was running towards him. And although they were not able to verbally communicate telepathically, the alien asked him for a substance that he needed for his vehicle.
Tom Kagy (03:11)
Okay, so what was the substance of what Sans has said about this encounter, other than the fact that he saw this alien and he was asking him, was he talking to him? mean, how did he manage to communicate?
Najla Zaidi (03:28)
So again, the communication is consistent always with even the abductions that is telepathically done. it was telepathically, you know, he told him that he needed this substance and he wanted to basically get back onto his craft and leave. And he was also disgusted at military programs studying extraterrestrial tech. So he was, you know, communicated that as well.
Tom Kagy (03:57)
Okay, and what the, I mean, how do we know that this Jason Sands actually had this sort of very close encounter? I mean, do we have any evidence that suggests that he actually had this encounter?
Najla Zaidi (04:14)
We don't have any evidence, but we do have the two other people that were in the vehicle with him that also backed up his testimony and what he said.
Tom Kagy (04:24)
Okay. What did he notice about this ⁓ alien? Anything in particular?
Najla Zaidi (04:28)
So
he said that he was a humanoid being. He communicated with him telepathically. And then he was a pale blue skin humanoid. He had large black eyes and no ears. And then he ran into him on a military test range. So why would this being be there if they were not actually doing UAP testing? And also, he was a credible person. Everything that he talked about having
seeing this, he also had top security clearance. Everything he talked about in seeing, you know, what was going on there was legitimate.
INSERT AUDIO 1
Tom Kagy (31:18)
Well, is there any other physical evidence that could only have been created by aliens or at least by people that are far more advanced than anything that we are aware of?
Najla Zaidi (31:32)
Well, on Betty Hill's dress, to her niece Kathleen Marden, she recently, like within the last few years, two or three years, she had more analysis done on Betty's dress. And on the fabric, they found rhodium and pteryllium, which is one of the two most rare elements on the earth, and it's usually found in space. And there's no other accounting for how it could have gotten on her dress. And there was also this pinkish powder.
which to this day it's been tested by five different laboratories. It's never been found of where this comes from.
Tom Kagy (32:09)
Okay, so they couldn't relate it to anything from Earth. Okay, so moving on from the Hill incident abduction, do you have any other physical evidence that could only have been left by aliens?
Najla Zaidi (32:11)
No.
The only, like, another one that is controversial, but there's enough evidence to prove that it could be ⁓ alien-related is cattle mutilations, because this has been going on since 1967.
Tom Kagy (32:39)
Okay, so what happens in calamity lasions?
Najla Zaidi (32:42)
So basically, like farmers have been reporting that their cattle are mutilated with great precision as if a surgeon has done this, removed their organs, which are usually like their heart, their reproductive organs, or like any other organ within the body. And the reason why we believe that ⁓ they're using cows,
is because they're mammals and they're large, but they're also very close to human in their anatomy and the way that they, you know, mammals are.
Tom Kagy (33:17)
Okay, well why couldn't just some humans have ⁓ grabbed the cattle and maybe euthanized them and then cut away the body parts that they wanted?
Najla Zaidi (33:31)
It could be humans too. It's possible that it's humans, but researchers that are very, very respected like Linda Howe, her name is Linda Moulton Howe. She's a renowned ufologist and she's been a journalist and researcher for many, many years. She's found too much evidence all over the world. And what happens every time that these mutilations happen, when it's an alien related mutilation, is that there are, ⁓
spacecraft near them that somebody has reported lights and spacecraft
Tom Kagy (34:05)
Okay, but again, that depends on a sighting. What about the actual ⁓ physical evidence left by the mutilations? What makes it ⁓ not something that could have been done by pranksters?
Najla Zaidi (34:16)
Well, around the mutilation, again, there's like a different electromagnetic signature that is, you know, other than normal to humans. Like it's different, like there's some sort of radiation usually, and there's some sort of electromagnetic change on that animal and in that surrounding area. And other animals will not go near that, you know, cow or they've done it also sometimes on pigs and horses, but normally it's cows.
Tom Kagy (34:48)
Okay, but what about the…
Evidence left around the cattle that were mutilated. Is there anything to suggest that it was not done by humans?
Najla Zaidi (35:01)
It's just like there's usually just, you know, the mutilation when it happens, it's so intensely removed, like it's so intensely removed that there's no even blood. Like there's no blood loss. There's absolutely, it's just a very precise cuts as if a supernatural surgeon did it. And there's no blood loss. There's no other evidence.
of any kind of scavenger animal or any other attack by any other animal.
Tom Kagy (35:33)
Okay, so after these cattle are mutilated, there's no blood found in the area and there are ⁓ no, what would you call it? I guess no insects that have been feeding on the.
Najla Zaidi (35:39)
No.
No, there's no insects. Right. mean,
when it's like a scavenger animal, it's a different scenario. it's also possible that there's internally from human, you know, when an animal dies from human gases will also make the animal explode or from, you know, scavengers attacking the cow. But those incisions are different. They look different. And there's, you know, there's blood loss and then the tears are different.
but these are usually exact precise as if a surgeon cut these parts open.
Tom Kagy (36:21)
Okay, and there are no further ⁓ depredations by scavengers after the mutilation.
Najla Zaidi (36:27)
No, and no
animal will go near that particular cow.
Tom Kagy (36:33)
Okay. All right. So aside from the cattle mutilations, by the way, how many cattle mutilations have there been? I mean, do they have any estimate?
Najla Zaidi (36:42)
There have been like hundreds and hundreds. The FBI has been looking at these files since the mid 1970s. So this has been going on and it's all over the world. they say, like the first report was they said at least since 1967. And it's not only in the America, it's all over the world. Like there was an incident in Brazil, which is famous in the 1970s, where they saw the UFO sightings and there were cattle being mutilated at
like an unnerving pattern. And so it was so extraordinary. Even the residents were reporting feeling weak or burned after the encounter. And again, there was like surgical-like incisions. internal organs were taken away, hearts, livers, reproductive organs, and their blood was completely drained. And there was absolutely no evidence that, you know, that any human had done this. And to this day, they have not been able to solve it.
Tom Kagy (37:37)
Any other evidence that you can think of that tends to make it impossible to believe that these sightings were the product of human activity?
Najla Zaidi (37:52)
There were some that are human activity, but these sightings, just the way that they stand out, and again, there are normally some sort of spacecraft is sighted in that vicinity the day before or around that time or within hours of the mutilations.
Tom Kagy (38:11)
Okay, well, I meant other than the cattle mutilations, are there any other types of evidence?
Najla Zaidi (38:14)
Oh, yes.
Well, so there's a another former U.S. Air Force Master Sergeant named Jason Sands, and he also has worked in intelligence roles at Nellis Air Force Base and Area 51. So he's made claims that he overheard communications indicating that there were nonhuman intelligence at the military installation.
Tom Kagy (38:39)
Okay, and so what types of things did he see or hear?
Najla Zaidi (38:44)
So what he's basically said is that he saw, he overheard a conversation where they referred to aliens and he actually saw a spacecraft. Now the DOD claims that he, that the word alien was a nickname for a spacecraft, like not a spacecraft, a ⁓ craft that the U.S. government was working on, a secret project. But again, you know, again, they've denied anything that he said. But he also,
claims that he had run in with an actual alien.
Tom Kagy (39:17)
Okay, and how did he describe that encounter?
INSERT AUDIO 3
Najla Zaidi (00:18)
Yes, he, so the encounter basically he spoke of was he saw that this, you know, person that looked not non-human, he was had bluish color, large black eyes. He was actually in the same uniform and dress fatigues. But the interesting thing was he had, his shoes were very shiny as if no dust had ever touched them. And when he was coming, he was running towards the vehicle.
that Jason was in. And he had a very funny gait and he looked when he got close to Jason it was almost as if he was going to fall over. And Jason thought maybe he was so pale he was going to die of hypothermia.
Tom Kagy (01:01)
Okay, so I assume it was a cold winter day then.
Najla Zaidi (01:04)
Yes, it must have been a cold day, but he was dressed like that, like ⁓ any other soldier, but he did not look physically like them.
Tom Kagy (01:12)
So he was part of the same unit that Jason was in.
Najla Zaidi (01:16)
Right, right.
Tom Kagy (01:21)
So what was the substance of the conversation?
Najla Zaidi (01:24)
So basically, in the distance, Jason was also able to see a small spacecraft. And he was looking, asking for tritium. But they never had a conversation verbally. Like just like every encounter with aliens, it's usually telepathically. So they were conversing telepathically. And he asked for tritium because that's what he needed in order to get in his spacecraft and leave.
Tom Kagy (01:50)
Okay, so what happened? What happened between them after that?
Najla Zaidi (01:57)
Like he told him that he doesn't have any tritium and this entire counter was also witnessed by the two other soldiers that were with Jason at the time. But afterwards they basically, like when he reported this, this ended up not being in any government report. So the only witness evidence that Jason has is the other two people. But Jason is an amazing artist and he drew.
He painted what this man, what this ⁓ alien life form looked like along with his spaceship.
Tom Kagy (02:35)
Okay, so he had an accurate drawing of what he claims to have encountered. Okay. So do we have any other evidence that in your mind overrides this disclaimer that the government keeps trying to issue saying that these are, know, what do call it, miscidings of natural phenomena or, you know, human objects? Do we have any other evidence?
Najla Zaidi (02:39)
Yes.
Well, mean,
there's just so many people in and out of the government who are now talking about this. And I think that, like, you know, they've tried to backtrack. They've tried to say that this hasn't happened. But when you even have a governor of Arizona saying, saw it too, then I think it's like none, not all of us are crazy. So everyone is seeing the same thing.
Tom Kagy (03:29)
Okay. Well, and also, guess, aside from what we discussed today, we had discussed the Vedas, the Indian Vedas, which are ancient sort of encyclopedias.
Najla Zaidi (03:38)
Right, ancient texts,
the ancient texts which refer to Atma, which Atma they believe is like life force, they've talked about that, that if everything they believe in the Vedas is accurate because it's real, so they've talked about aliens from that point. And it's interesting, in Hindu culture, it's just very commonplace. It's not something that's hidden or not discussed. It's just part of their culture. It's accepted as part of the culture.
Tom Kagy (04:07)
Right. And then I guess even in the Bible, there's in the book of Enoch, there's talk about him traveling in a spacecraft.
Najla Zaidi (04:14)
Right, and I've
read about that as well. Enoch has traveled in a spacecraft. He has also described, like, other, ⁓ you know, like, could be realms as heaven, but we don't know it could be another planet, for all we know.
Tom Kagy (04:28)
Right, right. it's, yeah, it is a little hard to believe that all these ancient peoples would make up sort of science fiction-y accounts of, you know, flying crafts or, you know, battles between flying crafts. We're talking about, you know, 2500, 3000 years ago.
Najla Zaidi (04:48)
Right, and even if you look at Australia, the Aborigines are one of the oldest cultures on earth. They also have accounts of flying saucers and invitations from centuries ago.
Tom Kagy (05:01)
Right, right. And of course we have our own here in the US and the Southwest where they talk about the star people and they actually draw UFOs and so forth. Okay. All right, Nigel. Well, that's been an interesting discussion. And I mean, I'm fully convinced that aliens have visited us and probably are visiting us constantly and that they're actually among us.
Najla Zaidi (05:08)
Right, exactly, Native American culture.
Tom Kagy (05:31)
So thank you for your research and your help in ⁓ clarifying this point.
Najla Zaidi (05:39)
Thank you so much, Tom. It's been a pleasure. And I, like you, 100 % agree that they're out there, and I think they will make contact within the next five to 10 years. I think so. From what's been happening, and Congress is talking about it, people are coming forward. I think we're going to have this some sort of contact within the next five to 10 years.
Tom Kagy (05:49)
Well, let's hope so. That would certainly be interesting.
Okay, great. Well, I'm certainly looking forward to it. Thank you, Najla.
Najla Zaidi (06:07)
Thank you, Tom.
View all episodes
By VoxcaliDespite recent government efforts to characterize US Navy UFO footage as products of a government disinformation campaign to distract from actual top-secret military aircraft projects, an abundance of encounters of various types show not only that aliens are behind many UFOs but that deep-black contractors are in possession of alien craft and alien "biologics" for reverse engineering efforts.
Transcript
Tom Kagy (00:02)
Hello, this is Tom Kagy with Unconventional Wisdom. Today we have Najla Zaidi, who will be our expert on the strongest evidence that we have of an alien presence here on Earth. Hello, Najla, how are you?
Najla Zaidi (00:20)
I'm good, Tom. Thank you for having me again. This is an exciting topic to talk about.
Tom Kagy (00:24)
Yes, I love the topic. think it's probably one of the most interesting topics that a human being can contemplate. OK, so now recently we've seen articles suggesting that, you know, some of the ⁓ UFO evidence that had been released by the New York Times, you know, namely the Tic Tac video and the ⁓ gimbal video, that these were.
Najla Zaidi (00:32)
Exactly.
Tom Kagy (00:52)
Somehow, I'm not sure they actually explained how, but they tried to suggest that these were deliberate disinformation releases by the US government and that they're not really ⁓ footage of an encounter with UFOs. Now, I don't believe that, ⁓ but…
Najla Zaidi (01:11)
Yes.
Tom Kagy (01:16)
even if that were the case, even if somehow they managed to defy the laws of physics and create these devices that were zipping around these naval pilots, even then I would say, well, even if you manage to do that, how do you explain all this other stuff that we've accumulated over the centuries and the millennia?
⁓ So today you're going to be telling us, I understand, about some of the strongest evidence that we have that we actually have been visited and in fact they're probably being visited constantly by UFOs.
Najla Zaidi (01:52)
And yes, we actually have been and there's just evidence that goes all the way back to 865 that we've been visited. And I believe personally that the reason why not only our government, but all the world's governments are not talking about this and are doing disinformation campaigns is to protect us because they're afraid too. They don't know, you know, how to deal with something outside of us.
Tom Kagy (02:20)
So they're afraid that we're going to all flip out and act like the people in the War of the Worlds episode ⁓ based on that fake radio broadcast. Is that what you're saying?
Najla Zaidi (02:30)
Exactly.
Yes, exactly, because this is something that, you know, from what our understanding is, they have technology that we don't understand and we're not even close to. So that's frightening in itself.
Tom Kagy (02:45)
Okay, that doesn't frighten me, frankly, because the way I look at it is if they're that advanced, they must have developed some sort of an ethical sensibility because you can't have a civilization becoming highly advanced without destroying itself unless they also develop a very strong ethical sensibility, essentially not going around destroying creatures for no reason.
Najla Zaidi (03:13)
I absolutely
agree with you on that. And from all the accounts that we've had, I would say the majority, 95%, have been benign. And they're just trying to learn about us. And only, as we discussed before, there were only a few accounts where it was hostile.
Tom Kagy (03:33)
Okay, yeah, so we did discuss that. right, Najla, tell us ⁓ what is the strongest evidence that you can think of? I mean, obviously it doesn't have to be in sequence because, you know, who can rate how strong a piece of evidence is? What's the strongest evidence that you can think of that would prove that aliens have been visiting us on Earth?
Najla Zaidi (03:53)
Well, I think the strongest, which everyone has seen is probably David Gersh's, who went before Congress under oath. And this is a person who is a former Air Force intelligence officer and even ex-co-lead of the UAP task force. And he came forward as a whistleblower and said, there's things going on that Congress is not aware of and the people are not aware of.
Tom Kagy (04:18)
Okay, so what were the things that he thought that should be brought to the attention of Congress and the American people?
Najla Zaidi (04:25)
Well, he basically said that he had interviewed over 40 high-end people in the military with top security clearance, which he also has, top security clearance, who had witnesses ⁓ like UAP crash retrievals. And then actually, the government, along with companies, ⁓ aerospace-type companies, had reverse engineered these programs.
Tom Kagy (04:53)
Okay, so basically he's saying that the whole ball of wax is there. mean, UFOs, aliens, alien technology actually being taken apart and used to develop projects. So what did he offer though as far as proof that what he's saying is backed up?
Najla Zaidi (05:19)
Well, the problem that he had, is because this is so high security, it's classified information, the only way that he could tell Congress would be in a classified location like a SCIF. But there were actually two…
Tom Kagy (05:35)
When
you say a skiff, explain to us what a skiff is.
Najla Zaidi (05:40)
So,
SCIF is basically a secure classified setting within the government and everyone has classified clearance in order to be in that room. And it's a room where absolutely there's no sound, there's no way that any other government or any other human being could be in on that conversation. And he was more than willing to do that with any members of Congress, but they would have to have the clearance in order.
to talk to him in that environment.
Tom Kagy (06:11)
Okay, so he was ready to name names and dates and locations, they, what happened? I mean, why didn't they go ahead and have this disclosure?
Najla Zaidi (06:22)
They are.
It is ongoing. They are talking about continually talking to him in private because the reports that he made to the intelligence community inspector general, the ICIG, he gave all the information, the names, the dates, the times, the locations in his whistleblower report. So that part of government has the information already.
Tom Kagy (06:47)
Okay, so you're saying that he has already provided information to congressional investigators, but that they can't actually talk about it to the public until it's been cleared by. Okay, okay, so.
Najla Zaidi (06:58)
Right.
The DOD, yes.
Tom Kagy (07:05)
Has there been an actual SCIF meeting in which he has detailed all of the ⁓ locations and names and projects and so forth?
Najla Zaidi (07:17)
not with Congress, there has been with the intelligence community people that he gave the information to when he filed the whistleblower claim. Because when he filed his claim, he went through the proper channels and they do have all that information, but they've not released it.
Tom Kagy (07:33)
Okay, so what,
okay, so I mean, do they have any reason why they're not making any of that public? mean, even if they don't get into particulars, it might compromise confidentiality or rather.
Najla Zaidi (07:47)
Well,
according to him, the people that have this information that are a part of this are high-end people in both in and outside of the government. So there are corporations that are also involved, and there are government officials very high up in the military. So that's why they're in charge of the material.
Tom Kagy (08:11)
Okay, so
who has been putting the kibosh on releasing this information or in at least, you know, giving some idea of what was learned at these discussions with Grush?
Najla Zaidi (08:26)
So it's basically the Pentagon and the Department of Defense because they are the ones that don't want this information to get out and they've been evading. They've been using like a particular, ⁓ it escapes me the exact name of the government document, but they're using this in order to not tell, basically not report to Congress what they're doing.
And every year, like the Department of Defense's budget is classified. So Congress has no access to it. So part of this budget is what Gersh is saying is used for this kind of technology with corporations and giving the technology to corporations to secretly work on it. So the money's coming in from the DOD budget and also from private corporations.
Tom Kagy (09:20)
Okay, so the reason they're able to keep it this confidential is that the actual details of the projects are in the hands of these deep black corporations, these deep black contractors with the defense firm.
Najla Zaidi (09:32)
Right, exactly. In
accordance with the Department of Defense.
Tom Kagy (09:38)
Okay. What about the members of the House or the Senate? mean, have they been fully cooperative with his efforts, Grush's efforts to get this information out to the public?
Najla Zaidi (09:53)
The guy,
he has not spoken to the Senate, he only spoke to the Congress and Congress has been very supportive and protective actually of him because he stated that his life, his wife's life and other people that supported him within the departments have been threatened basically as a result of him speaking out. So they are protecting him. However, in the Senate, the, ⁓
Sean Kilpatrick, he's the director and he's the director of the AARO, the Department of Defense and the Pentagon that works with the UAPs. And he, know, under oath testified to the Senate that there's no evidence of aliens. But Gersh is saying that he lied, that this is not true.
Tom Kagy (10:42)
Okay, are there any specific senators who have?
access to this information.
Najla Zaidi (10:50)
Not that I'm aware of.
Tom Kagy (10:53)
Okay, so, well, so there's this treasure trove of information that Grush is able to reveal, but only if he knows that he's not going to be sentenced to 20 years in the federal penitentiary for revealing it. otherwise, we can only take his word that there are these ⁓ programs that have possession of UFOs and alien bodies. Is that correct?
Najla Zaidi (11:21)
Yes, that's correct. At this point, we can take his word and then there were two officials within the UAP that were former officials and they both backed him up too and said that what he's saying is accurate.
Tom Kagy (11:34)
What kind of guy is Grush? mean, is he somebody that deserves to be believed?
Najla Zaidi (11:39)
Yes, absolutely. was he I actually listened to and read the entire ⁓ his entire, you know, that he made under oath in front of the House Committee. And he was logical. He was consistent. He's had an excellent reputation his entire career. He's done been in his high end. He has top secret and SCI clearance for over 14 years. And there's never been anything negative.
that he's done, as part of his job or otherwise.
Tom Kagy (12:14)
Okay. All right. Well, I guess that particular treasure trove of evidence will have to be locked up until ⁓ somebody in, I guess, in the Senate or maybe the Defense Department is willing to corroborate what he says and to reveal this information. But aside from what people have said, I mean, do we have any actual like tangible, undeniable physical evidence?
That shows that we've had advanced aliens visiting the Earth. ⁓
Najla Zaidi (12:47)
Well, like the an interesting one, which is also very recent, was the Phoenix Lights summary. The Phoenix Lights was really interesting because so many people saw it, including the governor at the time. And he said, you know, the governor, his name was Phyfe Symington, Arizona's governor. This happened in March 13th of 1997, where hundreds and hundreds of people across Arizona and even into Nevada saw
these light red and orange lights in the sky. So this was undeniable because it was caught on camera and everyone saw it including the governor.
Tom Kagy (13:24)
Okay, so there is footage of these UFOs.
Najla Zaidi (13:28)
Yes, there's actual footage and not just one person and then so many witnesses, which included private citizens and amateur astronomer with a telescope named Mitch Stanley. And then even the governor himself saw it and said that this was out, his exact words were otherworldly and bigger than anything I've ever seen before.
Tom Kagy (13:50)
Okay, so they're able to make out
some outline or shape and size.
Najla Zaidi (13:54)
Yes, they said
that it was gigantic and it was in the shape of almost like a big square floating through the sky.
Tom Kagy (14:04)
Well, still we're now, okay, we have footage, so that's two dimensions, but do we have anything that's three dimensional that would tend to prove that we've had these visitors?
Najla Zaidi (14:15)
The three-dimensional things would probably be like crop circles, which are controversial, but there's enough evidence to show that they were made by life forms that are not human.
Tom Kagy (14:27)
Okay, so what about these crop circles would make it impossible for human beings to create them?
Najla Zaidi (14:34)
Well, there's certain things about the crop circles that are unique to, I mean, there have been a lot of people that have faked them, but the real crop circles, they're always surrounded initially by somebody seeing balls of light or some kind of a, you know, UAP or UFO. And then what happens basically in a crop circle is that a formation is made and it's usually right overnight or within a few minutes or a few hours. It comes out of the blue.
And it's usually in fields of some kind of grain or cereal. And then what happens is ⁓ the crop gets flattened down. So when it's been an actual one from an alien, you know, a lot of researchers that have done this for years say the same thing. The crops are flattened. There's no breakage. There's no damage to them. And on top of it,
in the areas where inside the circle there's been radiation.
Tom Kagy (15:38)
Okay, and what about on a more microscopic level? Is there any evidence in examining the actual plants themselves that they've been…
Najla Zaidi (15:50)
Yes, there was
a study done in the 1990s by Dr. Levengood and Hasselhoff, and they basically checked the plant nodes, plants naturally have three or four nodes in them that look like knuckles, like on your fingers. And these knuckles basically not only exploded, but they grew in size from being ⁓ roughly… ⁓
like a few centimeters to up to 45 to 200 percent they elongated and Even one of the BLT this company that Leavenworth was working for was called BLT research so Nancy Talbot was one of the researchers who actually worked on the plants and she said that without a doubt there were two scientifically documented changes all over the world and they were consistent that the a pickle not
and node elongation was the first node beneath the seed head. That node became elongated and it stretched in comparison to the control nodes in the field. And it ranged from 45 to 200%. And then other ones, the cavity's holes literally blew out as if they were hit by some powerful force.
Tom Kagy (17:09)
Okay, so the changes to the nodes, the length of the nodes are things that could not be done by human beings, I assume. I mean, they didn't find this on the fake crop circles.
Najla Zaidi (17:20)
No, this is absolutely-
No, this was nothing on the fake crop circles. Plus, the fake crop circles had evidence where they were like the stocks were broken. There were proof like, you know, of footprints and these sort of things, which were not there in the actual ones. And the investigators who've been to actual, there's one in fact, her name's Linda Moulton. She's a journalist, is very respected journalist, and she's been to these crop circles, not only in England, but all over the world.
And she said, it feels different. You can see the difference, that she's done both. And in fact, one of the greatest ones was called a golden ball formation, and it formed overnight in 2005. And they have pictures from the actual, ⁓ you know, from when it actually happened. And even the flowers on top of the stocks have not been disturbed, which is not the case when it's fake.
Tom Kagy (18:17)
Okay, so now how many crop circles have they recorded?
Najla Zaidi (18:22)
There have been like over 10,000 formations from all over the world. And they've been reported in 50 different countries. And they've come from being very small to hundreds of feet across. And the other interesting thing is the real crop circles after the crops are harvested, they leave a ghost imprint that doesn't go away for a very long time.
Tom Kagy (18:43)
Okay, so the hoaxers would have had to have been very clever and extremely diligent to make these 10,000 crop circles.
Najla Zaidi (18:55)
Right, mean, plus one of the, I believe it was one of the investigators, I believe it was Charles Mallett, he's been investigating them since the 1990s. And he said that, you know, there's like a clear pattern of damage that doesn't happen, including bruising and scraping down the stems. And they use boards to crush them, they use ropes and boards to crush.
Tom Kagy (19:24)
You're talking
about the Hoxers, ⁓
Najla Zaidi (19:25)
Yes, yes, the hoaxsters. And the aliens
don't have anything like that. Plus, there's radiation.
Tom Kagy (19:32)
Are the farmers upset about these crop circles? mean, are these aliens destroying their arable land by creating these giant formations, or what's the impact that these crop circles have?
Najla Zaidi (19:41)
It's kind of
funny, the impact is that they get so much attention that none of them have ever complained about it because they get so much attention. Plus the fake circles are usually produced near where there's populations and cities, whereas the alien ones are usually in areas where there's not a population or it's more remote.
Tom Kagy (20:07)
Okay, well what about the fertility of the areas that have had the crop circles? Are the crops able to grow as well or better or worse?
Najla Zaidi (20:16)
They're growing
from within the circle where the crop circles are, the seeds that are taken from that and replanted end up growing five times faster and are five times healthier than the normal crops, which is very interesting.
Tom Kagy (20:32)
So it sounds like the aliens might be trying to help these poor farmers out.
Najla Zaidi (20:34)
I think so too. mean
whatever they're doing it's positive.
Tom Kagy (20:39)
Okay. All right. now do we have any, you mentioned that people saw ⁓ some of these crop circles actually being formed in real time. Do we have any footage or photographs showing some UFO ⁓ zipping around creating these amazing crop circles?
Najla Zaidi (20:58)
In Wiltshire, England, I was not able to find the video, but in Wiltshire, England, 1990, there were balls of light that were actually seen to lay the crops flat. And it was filmed. And that's like one of the ones that are the most famous crop circles in the world. And then like another thing too that the scientists have said that the way that the actual crop circles are formed, they contain mathematical astronom.
astronomical and scientific equations. Like one of the crop circles is an actual every turn of it is comes out to pie, you know, in science.
Tom Kagy (21:37)
Okay, so what about the ⁓ universality? mean, you're saying there are these crop circles everywhere. Are there ⁓ any signature patterns or anything that sort of seems to tie these crop circles together?
Najla Zaidi (21:58)
There's one interesting
thing that happened actually at ⁓ the Rockwell crash. There was a rock that was found at the Rockwell crash, which had an impression on it of a symbol. And it ended up that in 1996 in Chiseleden, England, that's where that image showed up in a crop circle, the exact image.
Tom Kagy (22:22)
Okay, so was it maybe somebody heard about the rock and then they faked the crop circle? I mean, is that possible?
Najla Zaidi (22:31)
It's remotely possible, but there was no connection at all. Like the rock had been found, I think it was years after the crop circle had already been there.
Tom Kagy (22:42)
Okay, so it would have had to have been a very big fluke for somebody to have planted that rock and expected it be found by somebody else.
Najla Zaidi (22:51)
Exactly. like some space astronaut theorists, believe that these crop circles are kind of like markers for aliens to know where to land and where to come. And they're leaving messages for each other and possibly for us, but we're not understanding them yet.
Tom Kagy (23:12)
Okay, aside from crop circles, do we have any other physical tangible evidence that's compelling that the aliens are visiting us now?
Najla Zaidi (23:23)
Um, there was a, and that one, like one of the earliest accounts, which is one of the most famous accounts is the Betty Barney and Betty Hill, who were actually, you know, claimed to have been abducted in back in 1961. And there was so much information that they have to this day, their niece Kathleen Mars Martin has a website and she's still
working on bringing their case to the surface and she's actually written a book recently with new evidence and there's more evidence.
Tom Kagy (23:57)
Okay, so what happened to this couple, Barney and Betty Hill?
Najla Zaidi (24:01)
So Barney and Betty Hill were driving through New Hampshire around 10, 1030 at night and they saw this bright glowing object and it appeared to be following their car.
Tom Kagy (24:13)
Okay, and then what happened?
Najla Zaidi (24:14)
And so Betty said, the way she described it, it said she first thought it was a falling star, but then the falling star started to go upwards instead of down like they normally do. And so they ended up, as they kept driving, saw that this thing was following them and they described it as a saucer shape, just exactly the way that we see it. So finally, Barney was so frightened that he even stopped, they had their dog, Delcie with them as well.
They stopped to let the dog out and at that point Barney had a gun in the trunk and he was so frightened that he even pulled out his gun and put it under his seat in the car. And so they stopped two times before they finally were actually forced to stop by this spaceship that was stopped in front of them in the woods.
Tom Kagy (25:06)
Okay, so were they taken aboard?
Najla Zaidi (25:09)
Yes, like they describe this as being kind of feeling like an out of body experience, as if they were sleepwalking. And they said that Barney actually said that as the spaceship got closer to their car, he could see, he looked up and he could see there were about 12 figures that looked non-human. And these were like, you know, as we've heard over the years, the grays, they had the big dark eyes and gray skin.
and they were basically, you know, stopped him, they, six of them came out of the ⁓ spaceship and like led them into their spaceship basically. And they both remember walking up a ⁓ kind of like a ramp into the spaceship, but then they had no memory of what happened until they ended up going to a very reputed psychiatrist at the time, Dr. Simon.
and went under hypnosis to recover those memories.
Tom Kagy (26:07)
Okay, and what were some of the memories that he managed to recover that tends to show that this was not just some hoax or some false memory?
Najla Zaidi (26:18)
So what happened was basically under hypnosis, they discovered that they were tested. Both of them were individually tested separately in separate rooms. And on Betty, they actually had torn her dress. They asked her to take off her dress, and it was like a doctor and two or three other aliens. And they couldn't do the zipper, so they tore the zipper, they tore the hem of her dress. And they did a pregnancy test where they put a needle through her navel and actually
There was on the dress, there was a blood sample that, you know, the DNA matched to be her blood. And then besides that, like she had asked them for a book, there was a book there, the way they were communicating was through telepathy. And so she talked to them and asked them where they were from. She asked them, you know, various questions like, what are you doing? And they said, we don't wanna cause you any harm. We just want to take tests. So they took finger.
fingernail samples, hair samples, skin samples.
Tom Kagy (27:21)
Okay. But aside from the ⁓ fluid that they found on her dress that suggests that she had at least been punctured there by something. And of course it could have been somebody, you know, some earthling. But aside from that, is there any other circumstantial or physical evidence that would tend to conclusively show that ⁓ she's not imagining or making this episode up?
Najla Zaidi (27:49)
Yes, there was. She had a book that she asked the leader if she could keep and he initially said yes, but then as they were sending her back to her car, he took it back. And in that book, she had seen a map and she recreated the map and years and years later, initially everyone thought she was nuts, but years and years later, it was a map of a star system.
Tom Kagy (28:13)
A map of what?
Najla Zaidi (28:18)
of where they came from. asked them where they came from. Years later, ⁓ an amateur, basically she was an amateur, her name was Marjorie Fish, and she was an amateur astronomer, but she figured this out that it was a zeta reticulite star system.
Tom Kagy (28:21)
Okay.
So in other words,
she correlated the drawing that Betty made with an actual star system that's somewhere out there.
Najla Zaidi (28:46)
Yes, yes, and it's been confirmed. Now there's some controversy on it. A few astronomers say that it's not real, but other astronomers say that it is real. So it does match up to exactly what Betty had drawn. And aside from that, in the book, the symbols that were in the book, which was the alien's language, that has been confirmed also when Betty drew those. It's been confirmed also.
that this all abductees since the 1970s are drawing the exact same symbols.
Tom Kagy (29:19)
Same symbols as where? you mean every time they're referring to that incident, the symbols were exactly the
Najla Zaidi (29:24)
Right,
every time an adepti draws symbols of what their language was or what they saw on the spacecraft, it's always exactly the same. And Betty drew the same thing.
Tom Kagy (29:38)
Was there any other like physical evidence left behind by this encounter that
Najla Zaidi (29:46)
yes, was, Barney had scuffed shoes with vegetation on his shoes. And this is from being taken into the woods, because the last thing he remembered was being on the road. And he had very like dressed, nice shiny shoes that were scuffed up and they had vegetation. He had binoculars, the strap had been torn, like cut apart basically. And then on top of that, on their car, so they had said right before they were abducted,
They were hearing these beeping noises and felt vibrations like their car was vibrating. And on the trunk of their car, there were these perfectly round, shiny spots basically. And every time they took the compass to it, the compass would go haywire because it magnetically, those circles were, you know, often magnetically charged. And so those circles didn't go away for a very long time.
Tom Kagy (30:39)
Okay, so something zapped the car and created those circles of magnetized areas.
Najla Zaidi (30:46)
Yes, and they were like perfectly round like silver dollars and extremely shiny. Even when Betty got her car washed a month or two later, the circles didn't go away. So they were there for a very long time. She said in the winter is when finally the circles went away.
INSERT AUDIO 2
Tom Kagy (00:00)
Okay. Okay, Najla. So how far away ⁓ was this Zeta or is this Zeta reticulized star system?
Najla Zaidi (00:09)
So the Zeta Reticuli star system is only 39 light years away. So it's actually, you know, not that far from us.
Tom Kagy (00:17)
Okay, so it would have been entirely possible for an amateur astronomer to be able to match the star map to an actual astronomical data.
Najla Zaidi (00:27)
Yes, and then her account, actually Marjorie Fish was brilliant, and her account was backed up by actual astronomers too. After, you know, when she went, discovered this, she contacted, I believe his name was Webb, and he was an astronomer at the time, and he backed up what she said.
Tom Kagy (00:45)
Okay, so the fact that ⁓ Betty Hill was able to draw a star map that actually accurately depicted those aliens home planet in the Zeta Reticuli system way before ⁓ our astronomers had the capability to identify these stars. So in other words, what she was drawing was information that
could only have been gotten from aliens, not from anybody on Earth.
Najla Zaidi (01:16)
Yes, absolutely, because no one on earth was aware of it at the time. And it took many years after this encounter when Marjorie Fish figured this out.
Tom Kagy (01:20)
Okay.
Okay. Okay. So let's move on to ⁓ the testimony. You had mentioned Sergeant, Master Sergeant Banks as providing some testimony ⁓ that tends to suggest that the U.S. government, you know, kind of backing up
Najla Zaidi (01:40)
Yeah, yes.
Tom Kagy (01:50)
what is that, Grush's testimony that the US government is in possession of alien hardware and what they call biologics, I guess.
Najla Zaidi (02:00)
Yes,
that's what Jason Sands says that he actually saw a spacecraft, which the government denies that it was a spacecraft, and he overheard conversation about where they were referring to alien. And then he actually had an alien encounter himself.
Tom Kagy (02:20)
Okay, so describe that encounter for us.
Najla Zaidi (02:23)
So he was driving with two other people in his Jeep or vehicle across, he was at the Air Force base at the time, he was at a military installation, and he saw this funny looking, kind of like he was running sort of funny across the, towards his car, basically, that looked almost human but not quite, this was like a bluish colored figure with large eyes, it didn't have ears.
And he also saw a small spacecraft in the distance. this alien was running towards him. And although they were not able to verbally communicate telepathically, the alien asked him for a substance that he needed for his vehicle.
Tom Kagy (03:11)
Okay, so what was the substance of what Sans has said about this encounter, other than the fact that he saw this alien and he was asking him, was he talking to him? mean, how did he manage to communicate?
Najla Zaidi (03:28)
So again, the communication is consistent always with even the abductions that is telepathically done. it was telepathically, you know, he told him that he needed this substance and he wanted to basically get back onto his craft and leave. And he was also disgusted at military programs studying extraterrestrial tech. So he was, you know, communicated that as well.
Tom Kagy (03:57)
Okay, and what the, I mean, how do we know that this Jason Sands actually had this sort of very close encounter? I mean, do we have any evidence that suggests that he actually had this encounter?
Najla Zaidi (04:14)
We don't have any evidence, but we do have the two other people that were in the vehicle with him that also backed up his testimony and what he said.
Tom Kagy (04:24)
Okay. What did he notice about this ⁓ alien? Anything in particular?
Najla Zaidi (04:28)
So
he said that he was a humanoid being. He communicated with him telepathically. And then he was a pale blue skin humanoid. He had large black eyes and no ears. And then he ran into him on a military test range. So why would this being be there if they were not actually doing UAP testing? And also, he was a credible person. Everything that he talked about having
seeing this, he also had top security clearance. Everything he talked about in seeing, you know, what was going on there was legitimate.
INSERT AUDIO 1
Tom Kagy (31:18)
Well, is there any other physical evidence that could only have been created by aliens or at least by people that are far more advanced than anything that we are aware of?
Najla Zaidi (31:32)
Well, on Betty Hill's dress, to her niece Kathleen Marden, she recently, like within the last few years, two or three years, she had more analysis done on Betty's dress. And on the fabric, they found rhodium and pteryllium, which is one of the two most rare elements on the earth, and it's usually found in space. And there's no other accounting for how it could have gotten on her dress. And there was also this pinkish powder.
which to this day it's been tested by five different laboratories. It's never been found of where this comes from.
Tom Kagy (32:09)
Okay, so they couldn't relate it to anything from Earth. Okay, so moving on from the Hill incident abduction, do you have any other physical evidence that could only have been left by aliens?
Najla Zaidi (32:11)
No.
The only, like, another one that is controversial, but there's enough evidence to prove that it could be ⁓ alien-related is cattle mutilations, because this has been going on since 1967.
Tom Kagy (32:39)
Okay, so what happens in calamity lasions?
Najla Zaidi (32:42)
So basically, like farmers have been reporting that their cattle are mutilated with great precision as if a surgeon has done this, removed their organs, which are usually like their heart, their reproductive organs, or like any other organ within the body. And the reason why we believe that ⁓ they're using cows,
is because they're mammals and they're large, but they're also very close to human in their anatomy and the way that they, you know, mammals are.
Tom Kagy (33:17)
Okay, well why couldn't just some humans have ⁓ grabbed the cattle and maybe euthanized them and then cut away the body parts that they wanted?
Najla Zaidi (33:31)
It could be humans too. It's possible that it's humans, but researchers that are very, very respected like Linda Howe, her name is Linda Moulton Howe. She's a renowned ufologist and she's been a journalist and researcher for many, many years. She's found too much evidence all over the world. And what happens every time that these mutilations happen, when it's an alien related mutilation, is that there are, ⁓
spacecraft near them that somebody has reported lights and spacecraft
Tom Kagy (34:05)
Okay, but again, that depends on a sighting. What about the actual ⁓ physical evidence left by the mutilations? What makes it ⁓ not something that could have been done by pranksters?
Najla Zaidi (34:16)
Well, around the mutilation, again, there's like a different electromagnetic signature that is, you know, other than normal to humans. Like it's different, like there's some sort of radiation usually, and there's some sort of electromagnetic change on that animal and in that surrounding area. And other animals will not go near that, you know, cow or they've done it also sometimes on pigs and horses, but normally it's cows.
Tom Kagy (34:48)
Okay, but what about the…
Evidence left around the cattle that were mutilated. Is there anything to suggest that it was not done by humans?
Najla Zaidi (35:01)
It's just like there's usually just, you know, the mutilation when it happens, it's so intensely removed, like it's so intensely removed that there's no even blood. Like there's no blood loss. There's absolutely, it's just a very precise cuts as if a supernatural surgeon did it. And there's no blood loss. There's no other evidence.
of any kind of scavenger animal or any other attack by any other animal.
Tom Kagy (35:33)
Okay, so after these cattle are mutilated, there's no blood found in the area and there are ⁓ no, what would you call it? I guess no insects that have been feeding on the.
Najla Zaidi (35:39)
No.
No, there's no insects. Right. mean,
when it's like a scavenger animal, it's a different scenario. it's also possible that there's internally from human, you know, when an animal dies from human gases will also make the animal explode or from, you know, scavengers attacking the cow. But those incisions are different. They look different. And there's, you know, there's blood loss and then the tears are different.
but these are usually exact precise as if a surgeon cut these parts open.
Tom Kagy (36:21)
Okay, and there are no further ⁓ depredations by scavengers after the mutilation.
Najla Zaidi (36:27)
No, and no
animal will go near that particular cow.
Tom Kagy (36:33)
Okay. All right. So aside from the cattle mutilations, by the way, how many cattle mutilations have there been? I mean, do they have any estimate?
Najla Zaidi (36:42)
There have been like hundreds and hundreds. The FBI has been looking at these files since the mid 1970s. So this has been going on and it's all over the world. they say, like the first report was they said at least since 1967. And it's not only in the America, it's all over the world. Like there was an incident in Brazil, which is famous in the 1970s, where they saw the UFO sightings and there were cattle being mutilated at
like an unnerving pattern. And so it was so extraordinary. Even the residents were reporting feeling weak or burned after the encounter. And again, there was like surgical-like incisions. internal organs were taken away, hearts, livers, reproductive organs, and their blood was completely drained. And there was absolutely no evidence that, you know, that any human had done this. And to this day, they have not been able to solve it.
Tom Kagy (37:37)
Any other evidence that you can think of that tends to make it impossible to believe that these sightings were the product of human activity?
Najla Zaidi (37:52)
There were some that are human activity, but these sightings, just the way that they stand out, and again, there are normally some sort of spacecraft is sighted in that vicinity the day before or around that time or within hours of the mutilations.
Tom Kagy (38:11)
Okay, well, I meant other than the cattle mutilations, are there any other types of evidence?
Najla Zaidi (38:14)
Oh, yes.
Well, so there's a another former U.S. Air Force Master Sergeant named Jason Sands, and he also has worked in intelligence roles at Nellis Air Force Base and Area 51. So he's made claims that he overheard communications indicating that there were nonhuman intelligence at the military installation.
Tom Kagy (38:39)
Okay, and so what types of things did he see or hear?
Najla Zaidi (38:44)
So what he's basically said is that he saw, he overheard a conversation where they referred to aliens and he actually saw a spacecraft. Now the DOD claims that he, that the word alien was a nickname for a spacecraft, like not a spacecraft, a ⁓ craft that the U.S. government was working on, a secret project. But again, you know, again, they've denied anything that he said. But he also,
claims that he had run in with an actual alien.
Tom Kagy (39:17)
Okay, and how did he describe that encounter?
INSERT AUDIO 3
Najla Zaidi (00:18)
Yes, he, so the encounter basically he spoke of was he saw that this, you know, person that looked not non-human, he was had bluish color, large black eyes. He was actually in the same uniform and dress fatigues. But the interesting thing was he had, his shoes were very shiny as if no dust had ever touched them. And when he was coming, he was running towards the vehicle.
that Jason was in. And he had a very funny gait and he looked when he got close to Jason it was almost as if he was going to fall over. And Jason thought maybe he was so pale he was going to die of hypothermia.
Tom Kagy (01:01)
Okay, so I assume it was a cold winter day then.
Najla Zaidi (01:04)
Yes, it must have been a cold day, but he was dressed like that, like ⁓ any other soldier, but he did not look physically like them.
Tom Kagy (01:12)
So he was part of the same unit that Jason was in.
Najla Zaidi (01:16)
Right, right.
Tom Kagy (01:21)
So what was the substance of the conversation?
Najla Zaidi (01:24)
So basically, in the distance, Jason was also able to see a small spacecraft. And he was looking, asking for tritium. But they never had a conversation verbally. Like just like every encounter with aliens, it's usually telepathically. So they were conversing telepathically. And he asked for tritium because that's what he needed in order to get in his spacecraft and leave.
Tom Kagy (01:50)
Okay, so what happened? What happened between them after that?
Najla Zaidi (01:57)
Like he told him that he doesn't have any tritium and this entire counter was also witnessed by the two other soldiers that were with Jason at the time. But afterwards they basically, like when he reported this, this ended up not being in any government report. So the only witness evidence that Jason has is the other two people. But Jason is an amazing artist and he drew.
He painted what this man, what this ⁓ alien life form looked like along with his spaceship.
Tom Kagy (02:35)
Okay, so he had an accurate drawing of what he claims to have encountered. Okay. So do we have any other evidence that in your mind overrides this disclaimer that the government keeps trying to issue saying that these are, know, what do call it, miscidings of natural phenomena or, you know, human objects? Do we have any other evidence?
Najla Zaidi (02:39)
Yes.
Well, mean,
there's just so many people in and out of the government who are now talking about this. And I think that, like, you know, they've tried to backtrack. They've tried to say that this hasn't happened. But when you even have a governor of Arizona saying, saw it too, then I think it's like none, not all of us are crazy. So everyone is seeing the same thing.
Tom Kagy (03:29)
Okay. Well, and also, guess, aside from what we discussed today, we had discussed the Vedas, the Indian Vedas, which are ancient sort of encyclopedias.
Najla Zaidi (03:38)
Right, ancient texts,
the ancient texts which refer to Atma, which Atma they believe is like life force, they've talked about that, that if everything they believe in the Vedas is accurate because it's real, so they've talked about aliens from that point. And it's interesting, in Hindu culture, it's just very commonplace. It's not something that's hidden or not discussed. It's just part of their culture. It's accepted as part of the culture.
Tom Kagy (04:07)
Right. And then I guess even in the Bible, there's in the book of Enoch, there's talk about him traveling in a spacecraft.
Najla Zaidi (04:14)
Right, and I've
read about that as well. Enoch has traveled in a spacecraft. He has also described, like, other, ⁓ you know, like, could be realms as heaven, but we don't know it could be another planet, for all we know.
Tom Kagy (04:28)
Right, right. it's, yeah, it is a little hard to believe that all these ancient peoples would make up sort of science fiction-y accounts of, you know, flying crafts or, you know, battles between flying crafts. We're talking about, you know, 2500, 3000 years ago.
Najla Zaidi (04:48)
Right, and even if you look at Australia, the Aborigines are one of the oldest cultures on earth. They also have accounts of flying saucers and invitations from centuries ago.
Tom Kagy (05:01)
Right, right. And of course we have our own here in the US and the Southwest where they talk about the star people and they actually draw UFOs and so forth. Okay. All right, Nigel. Well, that's been an interesting discussion. And I mean, I'm fully convinced that aliens have visited us and probably are visiting us constantly and that they're actually among us.
Najla Zaidi (05:08)
Right, exactly, Native American culture.
Tom Kagy (05:31)
So thank you for your research and your help in ⁓ clarifying this point.
Najla Zaidi (05:39)
Thank you so much, Tom. It's been a pleasure. And I, like you, 100 % agree that they're out there, and I think they will make contact within the next five to 10 years. I think so. From what's been happening, and Congress is talking about it, people are coming forward. I think we're going to have this some sort of contact within the next five to 10 years.
Tom Kagy (05:49)
Well, let's hope so. That would certainly be interesting.
Okay, great. Well, I'm certainly looking forward to it. Thank you, Najla.
Najla Zaidi (06:07)
Thank you, Tom.