Tristan Harris, the co-founder of the Center for Humane Technology, talks with Recode's Kara Swisher in these two best-of interview excerpts. In the first interview, originally published in January 2017, Harris discusses his background and the Center's best-known initiative, "Time Well Spent." In the second interview, originally published in May 2019, he talks about a follow-on initiative called "Human Downgrading," a term chosen to describe what engagement-driven tech does to people without them realizing.
Featuring:
Tristan Harris (@tristanharris), co-founder, Center for Humane Technology
Hosts:
Kara Swisher (@karaswisher), Recode co-founder and editor-at-large
More to explore:
On Reset, Arielle Duhaime-Ross explores why — and how — tech is changing everything.
On Recode Media, Peter Kafka interviews business titans, journalists, comedians and podcasters about the collision of tech and media.
On Pivot, Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway talk about the big tech news stories of the week, who's winning, who's failing, and what comes next.
And on Season 1 of Land of the Giants, Jason Del Rey chronicled the rise of Amazon — and now, on Season 2, Peter Kafka and Rani Molla are examining "the Netflix effect."
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Best of Recode Decode: Tristan Harris

Decoder is a show from The Verge about big ideas — and other problems. Verge editor-in-chief Nilay Patel talks to a diverse cast of innovators and policymakers at the frontiers of business and technology to reveal how they’re navigating an ever-changing landscape, what keeps them up at night, and what it all means for our shared future.

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Today, we’re talking about the brand-new TikTok ban — and how years of Congressional inaction on a federal privacy law helped lead us to this moment of apparent national panic about algorithmic social media.

This is a thorny discussion, and to help break it all down, I invited Verge senior policy reporter Lauren Feiner on the show. Lauren has been closely covering efforts to ban TikTok for years now, and she’s also watched Congress fail to pass meaningful privacy regulation for even longer. We’ll go over how we got here, what this means for both TikTok and efforts to pass new privacy legislation, and what might happen next. 

Links: 

Biden signs TikTok ‘ban’ bill into law — The Verge


TikTok ban: all the news on attempts to ban the video platform — The Verge


Anyone want to buy TikTok? — Vergecast


Congress takes on TikTok, privacy, and AI — Vergecast


Tiktok vows to fight 'unconstitutional' US ban — BBC


‘Thunder Run’: Behind lawmakers’ secretive push to pass the TikTok bill — NYT


On TikTok, resignation and frustration after potential ban of app — NYT


Lawmakers unveil new bipartisan digital privacy bill after years of impasse — The Verge


A real privacy law? House lawmakers are optimistic this time — The Verge


Congress is trying to stop discriminatory algorithms again — The Verge



Credits: 
Decoder is a production of The Verge, and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Today’s episode was produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and was edited by Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Why the TikTok ban won't solve the US's online privacy problems

Today, I’m talking to Jason Citron, the co-founder and CEO of Discord, the gaming-focused voice and chat app. You might think Discord is just something Slack for gamers, but over time, it has become much more important than that. For a growing mix of mostly young, very online users steeped in gaming culture, fandom, and other niche communities, Discord is fast becoming the hub to their entire online lives. A lot of what we think of as internet culture is happening on Discord.

In many ways Discord represents a significant shift away from what we now consider traditional social platforms. As you’ll hear Jason describe it, Discord is a place where you talk and hangout with your friends over shared common interests, whether that’s video games, the AI bot Midjourney, or maybe your favorite anime series. It is a very different kind of interface for the internet, but that comes with serious challenges, especially around child safety and moderation. 
Links: 


Discord opens up to games and apps embedded in its chat app — The Verge


Discord is nuking Nintendo Switch emulator devs and their entire servers — The Verge


Inside Discord’s reform movement for banned users — The Verge


Discord ends deal talks with Microsoft — WSJ


Discord cuts 17% of workers in latest tech layoffs — NYT


Discord to start showing ads for gamers to boost revenue — WSJ


Discord says it intentionally does not encrypt user messages — CNN


How Discord became a social hub for young people — NYT


‘Problematic pockets’: How Discord became a home for extremists — WashPo


Discord CEO Jason Citron on AI, Midjourney — Bloomberg




Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/23898955

Credits: 
Decoder is a production of The Verge, and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Today’s episode was produced by Nick Statt and was edited by Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Discord CEO Jason Citron makes the case for a smaller, more private internet

Today, we're talking about Disney, the massive activist investor revolt it just fought off, and what happens next in the world of streaming. Because what happens to Disney really tells us a lot about what's happening in the entire world of entertainment. Earlier this month, Disney survived an attempted board takeover from businessman Nelson Peltz. While investors ultimately sided with Disney and CEO Bob Iger, the boardroom showdown made something very clear: Disney needs to figure out streaming and get its creative direction back on track. 

To help me figure all this out, I brought on my friend Julia Alexander, who is VP of Strategy at Parrot Analytics, a Puck News contributor, and most importantly, a former Verge reporter. She's a leading expert on all things Disney, and I always learn something important about the state of the entertainment business when I talk to her. 
Links: 

The Story of Disney+ — Puck News


​​Disney’s CEO drama explained, with Julia Alexander — Decoder


Is streaming just becoming cable again? Julia Alexander thinks so — Decoder


Disney Fends Off Activist Investor for Second Time in 2 Years — NYT


For Disney, streaming losses and TV’s decline are a one-two punch — NYT


Disney’s ABC, ESPN weakness adds pressure to make streaming profitable — WSJ


Disney reportedly wants to bring always-on channels to Disney Plus — The Verge


The Disney Plus-Hulu merger is way more than a streaming bundle — The Verge


Disney’s laying off 7,000 as streaming boom comes to an end — The Verge


The last few years really scared Disney — Screen Rant



Credits: 
Decoder is a production of The Verge, and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Today’s episode was produced by Nick Statt and was edited by Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Disney just fought off a shareholder revolt — but the clock’s still ticking

At the absolute most basic, Dropbox is cloud storage for your stuff — but that puts it at the nexus of a huge number of today’s biggest challenges in tech. As the company that helps you organize your stuff in the cloud itself goes all remote, how do we even deal with the concept of “your stuff?”

Today I’m talking with Dropbox CEO Drew Houston about those big picture ideas — and why he thinks generative AI really will be transformative for everyone eventually, even if it isn’t yet now.

Links: 

Dropbox AI and Dash make it easier to find your files from all over the web | The Verge

Kids who grew up with search engines could change STEM forever | The Verge

No, Dropbox's cafeteria didn't get a Michelin star | VentureBeat

It's official: San Francisco's office vacancy rate just set a record | San Francisco Examiner

Jeff Bezos: This is the 'smartest thing we ever did' at Amazon | CNBC

Dropbox is laying off 500 people and pivoting to AI | The Verge

Congress bans staff use of Microsoft's AI Copilot | Axios


Transcript: https://www.theverge.com/e/23892647

Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge, and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Today’s episode was produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and was edited by Callie Wright.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Dropbox CEO Drew Houston wants you to embrace AI and remote work

Today we’re talking about Vice, the media company: Where it came from, what it did, and, ultimately, why it collapsed into a much smaller, sadder version of itself. 

This is a lousy time for digital media, and it’s hard to make a profit from putting words on the internet right now. So when Verge senior reporter Liz Lopatto went to go report on what happened, she and I both assumed Vice had been done in by the brutal economics of digital advertising on the web. But the Vice story is more than that — in the word of one executive that talked to Liz, it was a “fucking clown show.” 

Links:

How Vice became 'a fucking clown show' — The Verge


Vice is abandoning Vice.com and laying off hundreds — The Verge


Vice, decayed digital colossus, files for bankruptcy — NYT


Vice Is Basically Dead — New York Magazine


Shane Smith and the Final Collapse of Vice News — The Hollywood Reporter


At Vice, cutting-edge media and allegations of old-school sexual harassment — NYT


HBO cancels ‘Vice News Tonight,’ severing relationship with Vice Media — CNN


Shane Smith has a secret multimillion-dollar Vice deal — New York Magazine



Credits: 
Decoder is a production of The Verge, and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Today’s episode was produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and was edited by Callie Wright. Our supervising producer is Liam James.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Best of Recode Decode: Tristan Harris

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