A great interview with Betsy Beyer and Stephen Thorne of Google, coauthors of the incredible "Site Reliability Engineering Workbook". We cover a lot of ground in this interview, including how Google learns from failures, what toil is and how good organizations try to fight it, and when LESS reliability can be a good thing in software development. Betsy and Stephen's work around publicizing and breaking down the myths surrounding SRE have been huge boons to our industry; we find their work and thinking incredibly helpful and influential. You'll love it too!