Legendary fight coordinator Burt Watson joins Between Rounds to tell his incredible story in combat sports. From his early days working with heavyweight icon Joe Frazier and traveling the world with Muhammad Ali on the Champions Forever tour, to becoming the iconic voice behind the scenes during the golden age of the UFC—Burt breaks it all down. He reflects on his time working alongside Dana White, his approach to protecting fighters, meeting Nelson Mandela, and how he created his famous "We rolling!" battle cry. This episode is brought to you by Graasi! Fuel up with organic barley water to keep your hydration on point. Use code BETWEENROUNDS at checkout for a deal on your order.

Between Rounds is brought to you by GRAASI. Use code BETWEENROUNDS for 15% off your order at graasi.com. On this episode of Between Rounds, John sits down with martial arts legend Pat Hardy—the first-ever Royce Gracie black belt, Vietnam veteran, former kickboxing champion, and criminal investigator. Pat shares incredible stories from his early days learning Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, including watching the original Gracie in Action tapes featuring Rickson Gracie and Zulu, and traveling to the Gracie Academy in Torrance. He breaks down his close friendship with Royce Gracie—including a wild story about getting stopped by game wardens in Texas—and reflects on the major differences between modern tournament BJJ and traditional Helio Gracie self-defense. The conversation also covers Pat's long career in law enforcement and martial arts, from winning the 1997 mainland national championship to building a 33-year legacy with his school, Texas Punishment Crew, alongside the Ebarb family. Pat also opens up about his tough childhood, the life lessons that shaped his coaching philosophy, and his experiences training with early BJJ figures like Steve Maxwell, Phil Migliarese, and John Burke.

MMA legend and Hall of Famer Urijah "The California Kid" Faber joins Between Rounds for Episode 29! In this episode, Faber reflects on his iconic career, from pioneering the lighter weight classes during the legendary WEC era to battling inside the UFC Octagon. He dives deep into what it takes to build a championship mindset, the lessons learned from founding Team Alpha Male, and how fighting has evolved both inside the cage and behind the scenes. Plus, Urijah shares his insider perspective on fixing the regional MMA pipeline and building a lasting legacy in combat sports. #MMA #UFC #UrijahFaber #TeamAlphaMale #BetweenRounds #WEC #MMAJournalism

ADCC champion, BJJ world champion, coach, author, and historian Robert Drysdale joins John Crouch for Episode 28 of Between Rounds.Drysdale takes a deep dive into the history of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and challenges some of the stories that have been repeated for generations. He explains why he believes modern BJJ is much younger than most people think, how a 1975 rule set helped create the ground focused sport we recognize today, and why Carlson Gracie may be the most important and underappreciated figure in the development of modern Jiu Jitsu.Robert also breaks down the roles of Helio, Rorion, Royce, Rickson, Maeda, and other legendary figures, discusses the relationship between Judo and Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, and shares stories of forgotten Vale Tudo pioneers like Euclydes Pereira, Ivan Gomes, and Waldemar Santana. He also explains why researching the history has forced him to question long accepted narratives and why he believes you cannot simply trust what you read online.The conversation eventually turns to Robert’s own career as an elite competitor and MMA fighter, the intense fear he experienced before competing, what he learned from training and coaching in Las Vegas, and why trust, loyalty, and team culture can matter more than having the most talented individuals in the room.👊 **Topics include:**• The real origins of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu• Why Robert believes modern BJJ took shape in 1975• Carlson Gracie’s overlooked impact on Jiu Jitsu• Helio Gracie and the myths surrounding his story• How Rorion Gracie and Royce Gracie changed martial arts forever• Royce Gracie vs. Rickson Gracie’s competitive legacies• BJJ’s connection to Judo and Mitsuyo Maeda• Forgotten Vale Tudo legends like Euclydes Pereira and Ivan Gomes• Why Robert questions accepted Jiu Jitsu history• Social media, AI, and misinformation• Robert’s fear and anxiety before competition• His ADCC and MMA career• Why great fighters need coaches they truly trust• The importance of culture and loyalty inside a fight team• Robert’s philosophy on coaching and developing athletesSubscribe to Between Rounds for more conversations with the fighters, coaches, and personalities who have shaped combat sports.#RobertDrysdale #BJJ #BrazilianJiuJitsu #JiuJitsu #CarlsonGracie #GracieJiuJitsu #ADCC #MMA #UFC #ValeTudo #BetweenRounds

Art Castillo joins John Crouch on Between Rounds for an in-depth conversation covering his entire path from small town Wyoming wrestling to leading a national championship program at Western Wyoming. Coach Castillo opens up about his upbringing in Green River, overcoming a devastating knee injury during his senior year of high school, and navigating the chaotic early days of regional combat sports. The discussion dives into his time at Dana College training alongside chaos magnet Buddy Leister, cornering Benson Henderson before either of them had high level experience, and the wild stories that defined their early years in the sport. Coach Castillo also breaks down taking over Western Wyoming, the grind of building an elite junior college environment from scratch, maintaining academic excellence alongside athletic success, and why leading with love, self awareness, and empathy is the true foundation of sustainable elite performance. Timestamps:00:00 Intro04:33 Art’s Wrestling Journey37:23 Becoming a Coach54:43 The Mental Game01:08:38 The Castillo Way #BetweenRounds #MMA #Wrestling #BensonHenderson #CoachCastillo

Former UFC, WEC, One Championship, and World Combat League veteran Anthony Njokuani joins us for a wide-ranging conversation on Between Rounds.Anthony reflects on moving from Nigeria to Garland, Texas, growing up as a problem child, and finding structure through breakdancing as a teenager. He shares how a chance encounter at a local gym led him to train under 6-time world champion Saxon, pivoting from top-tier b-boying to building an undefeated kickboxing record and jumping headfirst into mixed martial arts.We dive into his time in the World Combat League, fighting for the Oklahoma Destroyers, navigating early short-notice fights against top-tier competition, and his high-stakes WEC run—including his infamous knockouts of Chris Horodecki and Bart Palaszewski. Anthony breaks down his move to Las Vegas to train under Nick Blomgren, his battles against future champions and top contenders like Edson Barboza and Cowboy Cerrone, and the reality of fighting in bare-knuckle MMA.Beyond his fighting career, Anthony discusses his transition into coaching, opening his new martial arts gym, preserving traditional striking discipline versus modern MMA fight trends, and the life-changing perspective of becoming a father.⏱️ Timestamps:0:00 Intro & Nigerian Heritage01:21 Raising Kids06:26 From Nigeria to Texas: The Early Years13:53 From B-Boying to Muay Thai & WEC Wars50:24 Making it to the UFC & Epic Striking Battles57:09 Bare Knuckle MMA, Coaching & Passing the Torch1:06:21 Fatherhood, Roots & Legacy👊 Topics include:Moving from Nigeria to Texas and growing up in GarlandBreaking, b-boy culture, and developing early athletic footworkMeeting Saxon and transitioning from dancing to Muay ThaiFighting in the World Combat League with the Oklahoma DestroyersShort-notice fights, WEC title contention, and iconic knockoutsRelocating to Las Vegas to train with Nick BlomgrenBattles against Edson Barboza, Cowboy Cerrone, and Benson HendersonBeating 14-time K-1 champion Andy Souwer in One ChampionshipThe intensity and physical toll of bare-knuckle MMAOpening a new gym, coaching philosophy, and traditional fight IQFatherhood, family roots, and building a legacy#MMA #UFC #BetweenRounds #AnthonyNjokuani #WEC #MuayThai #Kickboxing #BareKnuckleMMA #FightPodcast #MartialArts

Al Escobar joins Between Rounds for an inspiring conversation on physical therapy, leadership, entrepreneurship, and what it takes to help people perform at their highest level.

As the founder of ERIS Physical Therapy, Al has spent decades working with everyone from everyday patients to world-class athletes. He shares the lessons that shaped his career, growing up in a military family, finding his calling in physical therapy, winning the NPC Mr. USA bodybuilding title, building a successful business, and developing a philosophy centered on service, integrity, and excellence.

Whether you're an athlete, coach, business owner, or someone looking to improve your health, this episode is packed with practical wisdom on discipline, leadership, and lifelong performance.

👊 Topics include:
• Growing up in a military family
• Finding a passion for physical therapy
• Lessons from Al's father
• Becoming the NPC Mr. USA champion
• Starting ERIS Physical Therapy
• Building a business from the ground up
• Leadership and company culture
• Helping elite athletes recover and perform
• Balancing business with serving people
• The mindset behind long-term success

📺 Subscribe for more conversations with world-class coaches, athletes, and leaders from the world of combat sports and beyond.

#AlEscobar #BetweenRounds #PhysicalTherapy #SportsPerformance #Leadership #Entrepreneurship #Bodybuilding #MMA #MMAPodcast #TheMMALab #CombatSports #Recovery #AthleteDevelopment #Performance #Mindset

Sports performance coach and mental performance expert Drake Davis returns to Between Rounds for a powerful conversation about what it truly takes to reach your full potential—both in sports and in life.

Drake breaks down the mental side of performance, explaining what separates good athletes from great ones, why so many people struggle to get started, and how the best competitors develop resilience through failure. From coaching philosophy and leadership to anxiety, routines, and training the mind, this episode is packed with practical lessons for athletes, coaches, entrepreneurs, and anyone striving to improve.

We also explore the connection between athletics and creativity, the role of fear in personal growth, how social media affects our mindset, and why becoming your best self starts long before competition.

Whether you're chasing a championship, building a business, or simply trying to improve every day, this conversation offers valuable tools for unlocking your potential.

👊 Topics include:
• What separates a good athlete from a great one
• The qualities of great coaches and leaders
• Dealing with struggle and adversity
• Overcoming the fear of getting started
• The connection between sports and art
• Performance anxiety and the fear of failure
• Building resilience after setbacks
• Knowing your opponent—and yourself
• Creating routines that improve performance
• Training the mind like a muscle
• The impact of social media on mindset

🎥 Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
1:33 What separates a good athlete from a great one
6:29 What makes a great coach and leader
11:08 Dealing with struggle
13:28 The fear of getting started
20:50 The connection between art and performance
27:45 Performance anxiety and the potential to fail
41:08 Getting back up after failure
59:10 Know your enemy
1:12:15 Understanding anxiety
1:23:34 Being present and building routines
1:28:03 Training the mind
1:43:03 Social media and mental performance

📺 Subscribe for more long-form conversations with fighters, coaches, psychologists, and leaders from across the world of combat sports.

#DrakeDavis
#BetweenRounds
#SportsPsychology
#MentalPerformance
#PerformanceAnxiety
#Mindset
#AthleteDevelopment
#SportsPerformance
#Leadership
#PersonalGrowth
#MentalTraining
#Coaching
#MMA
#MMAPodcast
#TheMMALab
#CombatSports
#PeakPerformance

Former UFC coach, All-American wrestler, and wrestling leader Leister Bowling joins us for a wide-ranging conversation on Between Rounds.Leister reflects on growing up in Colorado, being coached by his father from the time he was a young wrestler, and how those early lessons shaped his approach to competition, coaching, and life. He shares stories from his wrestling career, becoming an All-American, pursuing Greco-Roman wrestling, and training around the Olympic movement.We also dive into his transition into MMA, the early Colorado fight scene, and the journey that eventually led to the creation of Elevation Fight Team. Leister shares behind-the-scenes stories from coaching UFC fighters, cornering on some of the sport’s biggest stages, and what it was like helping build one of the most successful teams in MMA.Beyond fighting, Leister talks about the decision to step away from coaching MMA full-time, why family became the priority, and the fulfillment he's found in developing young wrestlers. He discusses building Colorado Top Team, mentoring the next generation, and watching his son carry on the family wrestling tradition at the Division I level.The conversation also covers coaching philosophy, athlete development, old-school wrestling culture, UFC stories, and how combat sports continue to evolve.👊 Topics include:Growing up wrestling under his fatherBecoming an All-American wrestlerGreco-Roman wrestling and Olympic aspirationsColorado wrestling and the evolution of the sportThe early days of MMA in ColoradoBuilding Elevation Fight TeamCoaching UFC fighters and cornering at the highest levelColorado Top Team and youth wrestling developmentFamily, legacy, and raising the next generation of competitors📺 Subscribe for more long-form MMA conversations, behind-the-scenes stories, and interviews with fighters, coaches, and legends of the sport.Tags#LeisterBowling#Wrestling#BetweenRounds#MMAPodcast#ElevationFightTeam#UFC#CombatSports#GrecoRomanWrestling#WrestlingCoach#MMAInterview#YouthWrestling#ColoradoWrestling#FightCulture#Coaching#AthleteDevelopment#CombatSportsPodcastGrowing up Wrestling 0:51Coaching Wrestling 8:48Wrestling Career 20:53Getting into MMA 30:15Quitting MMA 55:09Life after mma 1:13:45

Coach, podcaster, entrepreneur, and longtime MMA Lab leader Tim Welch joins us for episode 22 of Between Rounds.Tim reflects on his journey from growing up in Montana and competing in local smoker fights to becoming one of the most recognizable coaches in MMA. He shares stories from the early days of training, traveling to Team Quest, learning from some of the sport’s toughest competitors, and building a career around combat sports.We also dive into the rise of Sean O'Malley, including championship moments, difficult training camps, and the mindset required to perform on the biggest stages in the sport. Tim gives insight into coaching elite athletes and what makes special competitors different from everyone else.Beyond fighting, Tim talks about podcasting, content creation, family life, raising successful kids, and how technology and social media are changing the way people learn, communicate, and consume information.We also discuss the White House card, the state of MMA, opportunities for fighters outside the UFC, and why Tim hopes new promotions and platforms continue to grow the sport.This episode is packed with coaching insight, old-school MMA stories, current fight talk, and lessons learned from a lifetime in combat sports.👊 Topics include:Growing up in Montana and early smoker fightsTeam Quest and old-school MMA trainingCoaching Sean O'Malley and championship momentsThe mindset of elite fightersBuilding a podcast and content platformFamily, parenting, and life outside the gymThe White House card and today's MMA landscapeThe future of MMA and fighter opportunities🎙️ This episode is brought to you by Front Row AG.Front Row AG provides science-backed nutrients, additives, and cultivation solutions designed to help growers maximize quality, efficiency, and results. Built by cultivators and industry experts, their products are trusted by growers across the United States and around the world.🌾 Learn more at:www.frontrowag.com #SeanOMalley#BetweenRounds#MMAPodcast#UFC#MMA#TheMMALab#CombatSports#MMAInterview#Coaching#FightCulture#Podcasting#SeanOMalleyCoach#MMACommunity#MartialArts#CombatSportsPodcast#WhiteHouseCard#MMACoach#FrontRowAG