FamilyLife Today® Radio Transcript

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Are You Ready to Remarry?

Guest:                         Ron Deal

From the series:         The Smart Stepdad (day 1 of 3) 

Bob:  Ron Deal says he has talked with a lot of people who have been through a difficult first marriage that came to an end, and have been in too big a hurry to find someone else and marry again.

Ron:  “You know, we met on eHarmony, and we‟ve met face-to-face once.  We live on opposite sides of the universe, but that‟s not going to be a problem for us.  We‟re in love!  eHarmony says we‟re a match.”

Wait a minute, wait a minute.  Slow down.  That hurried, desperate need to be together with somebody is telling you something about yourself.  You need to come to terms with that, and get objective about it so that it‟s not driving you into a decision that wouldn‟t be a wise one.

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for W ednesday, June 1st.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I‟m Bob Lepine.  Marrying a second time, becoming a stepdad, is a huge challenge.  Today, Ron Deal helps you think through whether you‟re up to the challenge, or whether you need to press pause for a little bit.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us.

I‟m wondering why Ron Deal put Doc Martins on the front of his book?  A pair of loafers, but I think they‟re Doc Martins.  Isn‟t that yellow stitching around the top characteristic of the Doc Martins?

Dennis:  Ron?

Ron:  I don‟t have a clue!

(laughter)

Dennis:  You‟ve got to be careful around Bob.  I‟m telling you, he‟s tough on you.

Bob:  Did you pick the shoes for the cover of the book?

Ron:  I did not pick the shoes.  I influenced.  I know which ones I did not p ick.

Dennis:  Every author knows about that!  All the covers you reject.

Bob:  Is the idea here that if you‟re going to be a smart stepdad, you‟ve got some big

shoes to step into?  Is that the idea here?

Ron:  That, yes.  And, in a way, you‟re also stepping into someone else‟s shoes, but that person‟s already in their shoes.  It gets a little confusing.

Dennis:  You challenge a step-dad with “Steps to Help You Succeed.”  You really have

a heart for stepdads.

By the way, welcome to the broadcast.

Ron:  Thank you.  It‟s great to be back.

Dennis:  Sorry we critiqued your cover right off the start.

Ron:  That‟s alright.

Bob:  It wasn‟t a critique.  I was just curious.

Dennis:  You were critiquing it, Bob.

Bob:  The shoes do look a little scuffed up, too, I think.

Dennis:  Ron Deal is the founder of Successful Stepparents.  He is an author and a speaker.  He and his wife Nan and their sons live in Amarillo, Texas.  He has written the book The Smart Stepdad.  I didn‟t realize this, Bob, but 16.5 million men are stepdads today.

Bob:  That‟s a big chunk of the population.

Dennis:  Sixteen percent of all men will bear this title.

So you‟re talking to millions of men who step into these shoes.  They‟re going to find this much more difficult to do this thing of being a stepfather than they ever imagined.

Ron:  Many of them have the biggest hearts in the world.  They come in and they want to be the hero, you know?  They want to do a good job.  God bless them for having the heart for that.

Sometimes what they experience when they get there is like the first day on a new job, and people didn‟t know you were showing up.  They really would rather have the other guy there instead of you.  His name is still on the door, and you‟re moving into his office. You‟re really unclear what performing well on the job would look like.

How do I hit the bull‟s-eye in my new job?  It‟s really unclear.  Some people are telling you it looks like this, and other people are telling you it looks like this, and you‟re thinking, “W ho‟s on my team and who‟s not on my team?”  All of that confusion hits stepdads pretty quickly.

Bob:  And you add to that, maybe in your last job things didn‟t go so well and there were challenges, and there‟s still some anger and bitterness from the previous place you used to work, that left you feeling a little insecure about your role in the first place.

Now, here you are stepping into the new assignment.  You‟ve got to acknowledge when you step into a role as either a stepmom or a stepdad that ther e‟s some stuff in this pot of stew that you‟ve been cooking up here that is going to have be dealt with.

Ron:  Yes, and an application of what you just said about the former job:  many stepdads are biological dads.  They have their own children and they m ay live with them or they may not.  They may be with them on a part-time basis.

So, really, you kind of have two jobs.  One of those jobs is very clear.  It‟s very clear what it is to be the dad.  But it‟s just not so clear what it is to be the stepdad.  That‟s what we want to do with this book is offer them direction.

Dennis:  As human beings, we tend to be idealistic.  W e enter into this new relationship

– there‟s a honeymoon.  Maybe we did go through something where we experienced divorce in the past and we‟ve got that set of bags that we bring into the marriage relationship like we‟re talking about here, but don‟t you find that as couples form

blended families, that they have some unreal expectations about how it‟s going to work?

Ron:  Absolutely!  Absolutely.  The expectations are built on the fantasy.  Really, we need the fantasy.  W e need the dream.  There are a lot of risks in life that we wouldn‟t take if we didn‟t have a dream wrapped around it.  I think that‟s often true about remarriage, about becoming a stepparent.

The dream isn‟t necessarily bad or wrong.  I want stepdads and stepparents to hold

onto that dream.  But, at the same time, it needs to be tempered with reality; it needs to be tempered with truth about ...

FamilyLife Today® Radio Transcript  

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The Myth of the Ideal Stepfamily

Guest:                         Ron Deal                   

From the series:       Your Stepfamily:  Standing Strong

Bob:   Regardless of the circumstances, you may find yourself in a Brady Bunch of your own today, one that looks different than the TV family looked.  Here is Ron Deal.

Ron:   "Blended family" is the most popular term, but the point we like to make about that is that most stepfamilies don't blend.  If they do, somebody usually gets creamed in the process.  It's really a misnomer to use the term "blended family".  To me, it doesn't matter so much what families call themselves.  What they need to do is recognize that they have a different kind of family.  Learning how it operates, and how it works, and how they can make their family successful—that's what's really important.

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Monday, April 23rd.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.   If your special family is facing some special challenges, we’ve got some help for you today. Stay tuned.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us on the Monday edition.  A few years ago, I took my three boys—Mary Ann and I—took the boys.  We went to LEGOLAND®.  Now, you haven't been to LEGOLAND—

Dennis:  No, but I remember when you went.  You were really impressed.

Bob:  We were excited to go to LEGOLAND because our boys really are into—they love Legos®.  Well, the most exciting ride at LEGOLAND, which, by the way, when we were there, it was all geared for kids 12 and under.  

Dennis:  People are wondering where LEGOLAND is, Bob.

Bob:  Oh, LEGOLAND is in—it’s just north of San Diego.  It's geared for kids who are 12 and under.  There aren't a whole lot of scary thrill rides.  There is one rollercoaster, and it's moderately exciting as rollercoasters go.  My son, John, wasn't sure he wanted to ride on the rollercoaster.  We coaxed him and said, "Come on!  You'll have fun.  You'll like it.  It's not that scary."  

We all got on the rollercoaster.  We got all done; and Jimmy, who is a little older than John, said, "That was cool!  Let's do it again."  John said, "I am not doing that again."  He didn't ride the rollercoaster the rest of the day.

Now, I tell that story because, for a lot of couples, Dennis, who have gone on a marriage rollercoaster and have wound up apart—there's been a divorce—they look at the marital rollercoaster a second time; and they go, "That's scary.  Can we really make this thing work better the second time than we did the first time?"  A lot of them aren't sure they want to head on that ride again.  Then, those who get on it wonder, "How are we going to fix the problems when they come up this time?"

Dennis:  That's right.  Not everybody, Bob, who ends up on that stepfamily rollercoaster ends up there because of divorce.  Some end up there because of the death of a spouse.  They now find themselves strapped into a seat with all the turns, and ups, and downs, and they're wondering, "How do you build a successful stepfamily?"  

I want you to know, as a listener, we listen to you, too.  We listen to you on the internet, when you go to FamilyLife.com, and you tell us what you'd like to hear us talk about, here on the broadcast.  We also listen to you when you call into our 800 number.  We take notes.  One of the areas you've been asking us to do some work in is in the area of stepfamilies.

I want you to know that we have searched across the country; and in our own backyard in Jonesboro, Arkansas—which, yes, it is in the United States—but in Jonesboro, Arkansas, we uncovered a great resource that we want to share with you over the next few days, here on the broadcast.  His name is Ron Deal.  Ron, I want to welcome you to LEGOLAND and the rollercoaster ride of stepfamilies.  Welcome to FamilyLife Today.

Ron:  Thank you.  It is a great honor to be here.

Dennis:  He is on the Advisory Council of the Stepfamily Association of America, and he does seminars all across the country called "Building a Successful Stepfamily".  I've got to tell this story on Ron, as I introduce him.  I am in the Dallas-Fort Worth airport.  Ron comes up to me, and introduces himself, and gives me his card.  I ask him to send me some of his stuff because he told me he was working in the area of blended families or stepfamilies.  

I said, "Man!  There is a tremendous need there.  Send it on."  He sent it.  We've been in dialog, over the past few years, talking about this material and how we can bring it to our listeners.  I'm excited to feature Ron this week and talk about how we can equip stepfamilies, not only in helping them make their marriage go the distance, but also be successful as parents.

Now, when we come to the subject of stepfamilies, Ron, I think maybe the majority of us, who are married, underestimate the number of people who presently are in stepfamily relationships.  How prevalent is it?

Ron:  The numbers are really pretty staggering, especially to people that are unfamiliar with how many stepfamilies are out there.  Currently, every day in America, there are 1,300 new stepfamilies.  By the way, these statistics that I'm about to give you are anywhere from five to ten years old.  We don't have any real recent statistics.  So, we've got to keep that in mind.  In other words, there are probably more than even what we're saying now.  

One out of three Americans right now, in the United States, is either a stepparent, a stepchild, a step-sibling, or somehow related to a stepfamily—one out of three.  With the life projections as they seem to be, it looks like one out of two of us will have a step-relationship at some point in our lifetime.

Dennis:  You know, we've done a good bit of research at our FamilyLife Marriage Conferences.  Bob, you know, you speak at the conferences.  Up to 30 percent of those who attend our conferences are in stepfamilies.  I think we assume that stepfamilies have the same life expectancy as a regular family.  That's not so; is it, Ron?

Ron:  No, it's not.  In fact, the divorce rate for remarriage is 60 percent.  There are some numbers that indicate that it's more than that.  By the way, I need to kind of qualify that statistic.  We don't have a statistic that tells us what the divorce rate is for stepfamily couples.  We only have a rate for remarriage.  Now, some remarriages don't involve children.  Obviously, the bulk of remarriages do involve children and qual...

FamilyLife Today® Radio Transcript  

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Finding Realistic Expectations

Guest:                         Ron Deal

From the series:       Your Stepfamily:  Standing Strong (Day 2 of 5) 

Bob:  One of the big issues for children in a stepfamily is trying to figure out where their loyalties lie.  Here’s Ron Deal.

Ron:   The child, after remarriage, now says, "Okay, wait a minute. This guy, I guess, is now my dad; or he's my stepdad or something."  They almost feel some obligation to have a relationship with him; but, at the same time—in the back of his mind—his biological dad is in another home, saying, "Now, don't enjoy him too much." This 11-year-old is getting the idea that, “I can't be loyal to my stepdad because it would be disloyal to my biological dad.”

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Tuesday, April 24th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.  There are a lot of tangled relationships that happen when families get blended.  It can be tough to try to untangle some of those.  We’ll talk more about that today.  Stay tuned.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us on the Tuesday edition.  We're going to do a little cooking today on the broadcast.  We've got a recipe we're going to bring out and just see what we can whip up, here in Mr. Rainey's kitchen.  (Laughter)  How's that?  Mr. Rainey's kitchen!

Dennis:  We're going to talk about stepfamilies.

Bob:  You're going to give that guy—what's his name on the Food Network™?—give him a run for his money.

Dennis:  I have some recipes, Bob.  You underestimate me.

Bob:  No, I have tasted your cooking.  It's very good.

Dennis:  I like to cook.  Unfortunately, I like to eat, too.

Bob:   That's right. (Laughter)

Dennis:  We're not going to talk about cooking on the broadcast—except, in just a moment, we are going to give you a recipe for how to cook a stepfamily; alright?  We have with us the master chef, Ron Deal.  Ron, welcome to FamilyLife Today.

Ron:   Thank you.  It's great to be back.

Dennis:  Ron does seminars, all across the country, called "Building a Successful Stepfamily".  You've, I guess, talked to thousands of folks in churches, and small groups, and retreats, all across the country, over the past ten years?

Ron:   Yes.

Dennis:  Ron and his wife live in Jonesboro, Arkansas, with their three sons.  He's a minister.  He's a counselor—I think, has got a lot to say that's very, very helpful.  He has a recipe.  It's “How to Cook a Stepfamily”.  Now, did you come up with this recipe yourself, Ron?

Ron:   Actually, I did.  You know, I was thinking, one day, about the blended family and that metaphor.  We said on yesterday’s program that most stepfamilies don't blend, and somebody usually gets creamed if they do.  I started thinking, “Well, if they don't blend, how do you cook a stepfamily?”  I mean, the notion of a blender is—you put a bunch of ingredients in something and, all of a sudden, they become one fluid mixture.  

That's just not quite what stepfamilies end up to become.  So, “How do you do this?”  Well, I thought about the food processor.  That just chops somebody up, and somebody gets chopped up in the process.  For example, a parent who says to their child, "Okay, you need to call your stepfather, 'Daddy'.  We're not calling him 'Frank'.  We're not calling him 'Stepdad'.   You need to call him, 'Daddy.'"  In effect, Mom has just chopped up real dad.  He lives somewhere else, but he no longer exists.  We've chopped him up; now, “This is now your new real dad.”  

That kind of pressure—that kind of message—really backfires within stepfamilies.  It doesn't work.  Food processor doesn't help.

I began to think some about the microwave. These are families who want to be a nuke-lear family.  (Laughter)

Dennis:  Did you catch that, Bob?

Ron:  It took you a minute; didn't it?

Dennis:  Oh, no, I read it first.  I'd already caught it!

Bob:  Yes.

Ron:   They're working really hard to not be any different than anybody else.  They refused—I had a guy call in to a radio program I was on one time and argue with me.  "We're not a stepfamily.  We're not a stepfamily.  We're just like everybody else."  

Well, it's not a bad thing to be a stepfamily.  It's just a different kind of family; but, yes, you are one.  As long as you refuse to acknowledge that, you're not going to be able to find any creative solutions.

Dennis:  I would think this would be more prevalent because of the fast-paced culture we live in and people going, “You know, we've made a new family.  We've got to make this happen quickly."

Ron:  Yes, and microwave it.  “Let's just make it happen instantly.”

Dennis:  Yes, push the button.

Ron:   It doesn't work.  That's the same thing with a pressure cooker.  You know, “We're just going to add a lot of pressure.  We're going to force each other to love one another. If the kids don't do it, we're going to be really upset with them because they've been unwilling to do that.”  All of those things backfire.

The one other approach that really doesn't work is called the tossed salad.  That's where we just kind of throw one another up in the air.  I think about the family—for example—that when one of their children, who has part-time residence in another home; but then, there are some children that remain in the home over the weekend.  “While you're gone, your possessions are ours.”

You know, let's stop and think about that for a minute.  If my possessions, when I'm at dad's house—all of a sudden—anybody can play with my stuff, and mess up my room, and get into my drawers, or play with my toys—then, I don't have a place, really, in that home.  The tossed salad is, “We'll just toss you up in the air.  Wherever you come down, you're supposed to be okay with that.”

It's really disrespectful for parents to do that.  You need to set up a rule that says, "Can we use your stuff?  Can Johnny ride your bike while you're over at your dad's house?"  "Oh, sure, that's fine."  Okay, well, now we've at least been respectful to this child and given him a place, even when he's not there.

So how do you cook a stepfamily if all of those don't wo...

FamilyLife Today® Radio Transcript  

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Co-Parenting:  Visitation

Guest:                         Ron Deal                   

From the series:       Your Stepfamily: Standing Strong 

Bob:  One of the unique dynamics facing a stepfamily today is the ongoing conflict that can exist between former spouses and the impact that conflict can have on children.  Here is Ron Deal.

Ron:   I think parents really underestimate the ability of their children to handle the truth; but we do need to be respectful as we present that truth.  The fine line is, “Will you turn to criticism when it becomes a personal attack?”  That’s when it really begins to weigh heavy on the kids.  You know, when I attack your father, living in another home—parents need to understand that kid carries that pain because, “I’m half of Dad.”

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Thursday, April 26th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.  What can a husband and wife do to help children in a stepfamily navigate turbulent emotional waters?   Stay tuned.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us on the Thursday edition.  I have never forgotten a friend of mine.  I will call her "Beth".   She had been married, had a son—the marriage had not lasted.  She had been a single parent for a number of years.  Then, she met a guy.  This guy was—well, he was wonderful.  I was a little suspicious, frankly, of just how wonderful he was.  I thought, "She's been pretty lonely for a long time."  Not only that, but she wanted to have another baby; and she wasn't getting younger.

Well, the two of them got married.  I'll never forget—it didn't take long for her to arrive at work one day, and Beth said to me—she didn't look good.  I said, "Are you okay?"  She said, "Well, we had a pretty serious disagreement this morning."  I said, "What was it about?"  

She went on to explain that her new husband had tried to tell her son a few things that he needed to do and had started shouting at him.  She said, "I got in the middle, between the two of them.  I said, ‘You're not going to talk to my son this way.’"  The whole thing just kind of crumbled into everybody going in their own direction, and nobody feeling good about the situation.  I thought, "This couple needs someone who can sit down with them and say, 'You have got to start learning some new skills if you're going to make this thing work.'"

Dennis:  At our FamilyLife marriage conference, we focus in on giving people biblical skills in knowing how to build a marriage and a family.  One of the fastest-growing segments that are attending our FamilyLife marriage conference are those who are stepfamilies—those who find themselves in remarriage situations.  I'll tell you—they're eager, Bob, for those skill sets because they've been in the real-life settings where they're afraid that they may again experience the heartache of divorce.  Not all, but many who are in stepfamilies, come about it through that route—some through the death of a spouse.

All this week—we've uncovered a resource that we wanted to bring to our listeners.  We’re really thrilled to do so because of the specialized needs of stepfamilies.  Today, we want to focus on the subject that you brought up, Bob—the subject of step-parenting and how that works its way out in this new family formation.  

Ron Deal joins us for a fourth day.  Ron, it's been a treat to have you on the broadcast this week and glad to have you on FamilyLife Today.

Ron:  Thank you.

Dennis:  Ron is a minister, a counselor, and a speaker on the subject of stepfamilies, all across the country—has a seminar that he does.  Ron, one of the areas that you find the most relevant, as you teach on this subject, is this one right here.  In fact, you break down parenting into three areas:  parenting, step-parenting, and co-parenting.  Now, you've got to help me, what's a co-parent?

Ron:  It's complicated; isn't it?

Dennis:  It is. 

Ron:  Co-parents are ex-spouses or the biological parents of the children.  In other words, if there has been a divorce situation, the children are moving back and forth between two homes.  You are no longer married to your former spouse.  If you were never married, you're not in that situation with them; but you do have an ongoing parenting relationship with them.  

The way we like to say it is there's no such thing as ex-parents.  There are only ex-spouses.  So, you're forever tied through the children.  You have to work together; otherwise, the children can divide and conquer as they move back and forth between homes—just like they could within your home.

Bob:  Yes, and I don't know in what order we want to go through parenting—step-parenting or co-parenting—but as you've addressed the co-parenting issue right here—we get letters all the time, Dennis, from people who say, "Here is my situation.  I've come to Christ.  We're trying to raise our children in a godly, Christian environment.  We've got rules and things that our kids can't do; and then, they go visit Mom or Dad on the weekend."

Dennis:  “He's living with a girlfriend”—

Bob:  “They're watching R-rated movies”— 

Dennis:  —“drinking, doing drugs”—

Bob:  —“language”—

Ron:  It's one of the most frustrating issues that I find, whether we're talking about people that are still in single-parent years or whether they're in stepfamilies.  The other household has a tremendous influence on the kids; and they ask the question, "What can we do about it?"  

Here is my answer—first, and foremost, please accept and acknowledge that you do not control what goes on in that other home.  The reason I say that is because, under the guise of being concerned, there's a lot of ex-spouses that are still trying to control their ex-.  They're still trying to tell them what to do, and they've been divorced for years.  You've got to understand that divorce means you lose your right to influence the other person.  That's one of the unfortunate results of divorce.

Dennis:  Yes; but I can hear a single-parent mom or a woman who is in a stepfamily, right now, going, "But you do not know what my son is walking off into with his stepdad.  You're not telling me to just let him go off into that situation.  God's given me responsibility to protect him from evil."

Ron:  Well, ...

FamilyLife Today® Radio Transcript  

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Finally, A Father

Guest:                         Byron Yawn              

From the series:       What Every Man Wishes His Father Had Told Him  

Bob:  Every father leaves an indelible mark, an impression on the heart of his son, for good or for evil.  Here’s pastor and author Byron Yawn.

Byron:  Whenever I ask some man “What was your relationship with your father like?” there’s always this moment where they’re trying to figure out how to say it without being critical or dishonoring their father.  I think there are some men who have suffered greatly at the hands of their fathers, so I don’t invalidate the concept that we’ve all made a victim of someone in our life.  We are wretched and sinful people, but the cross doesn’t allow us to remain victims.  The cross allows us to overcome.

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Tuesday, May 29th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.  Byron Yawn joins us today to talk about some of the things that all of us wish we had heard from our fathers when we were growing up.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us.   I was going to start today by asking you a question, and then I thought, “No, it’s probably not a good question to ask.”

Dennis:  What was the question?

Bob:  I was going to ask you, on a scale of 1 to 10, what kind of a score would you give your dad?  How did he do? – 10 being he was great, 1 he was lousy.  Then I thought, “It’s not a good question” because then you’d ask me, “Well, what score would you give your dad?” and I would go through that process of trying to evaluate the score.  Then I thought, “Do we really want people starting to score their parents?”  That’s probably not --

Dennis:  There’s a lot of that occurring today.

Bob:  There is, and I –

Dennis:  It’s on the low end of the scale, too.

Bob:  And I don’t think it’s healthy for us to go there and dwell there, and muse about it and gripe about it.

Dennis:  No, I don’t think it is.  I think what’s most important, and you’re already hinting at it – we need to be talking about what is a man, what is a dad, what does he do, and how does he function under the lordship of Jesus Christ in his life.  We have a guest with us here on FamilyLife Today, Byron Yawn, who has written a brand-new book called What Every Man Wishes His Father Had Told Him.  Byron, welcome to FamilyLife Today.

Byron:  Thank you, Dennis.  It’s a privilege to be here.

Dennis:  Byron is a writer, a speaker; he and his wife, Robin, live near my son in Nashville, Tennessee, and they live there along with their three children, and have years of ministry.  I’m just curious, why would you tackle this subject?  You have three children.  Has the learning curve for you been a steep one as a dad?

Byron:  I think like every dad it has been steep.  The reason I tackled it on a personal level is that I was just compelled.  I’ve had many good examples in my life, and many bad examples in my life.  The truth is, I just love my sons desperately, and the world is a grinder and as a pastor I encounter a lot of failure on the male level, as husbands and young men.

Dennis:  You see a lot of men who don’t know how to be a dad?

Byron:  I do, and I see the consequence of it in young men’s lives.  So I didn’t want to be the cause of two more statistics, and I just sat down and started writing essays to my sons of things that I wanted to say to them.  So on the personal level it’s a father’s heart to his children.  Now I don’t know that I tackled it as much as it tackled me.

Bob:  You said you’ve seen good and bad examples.  You had two very clear good and bad examples, because your dad, the man who gave you life, didn’t stick around very long.

Byron:  He did not, and in no way was an example for me, nor had he had any major influence in my life.  As I look back on it now, as I’m 40, God spared me, but because of my adoptive father, Dr. Yawn, which is where I got the worst name any preacher could want –

Dennis:  Let’s spell it, so our listeners know.  They may have missed it.  It’s Y-A-W-N.

Byron:  Thanks for being explicit.

(Laughter)

Byron:  He so exemplified what it meant to be a servant, and he embodied the unconditional love of God as it is seen in the Gospel for me.  I was young enough that I didn’t have a real memory of my biological father, and I was young enough that I was forming my memories of who my father was based on the man that was in front of me.  Honestly, until the age of about 10, I didn’t really realize he wasn’t my own biological father, which I think is a testimony to his love.

Dennis:  You know, your story is providing hope for some listeners right now, who are in a second marriage, a blended family, and they’re wondering “Can redemption occur in the midst of a broken family” -- that took what was an ideal, something they had hoped for that would go the distance, and whether it was desertion, divorce, or a child out of wedlock or whatever it way, it’s now a blended family.  

Your stepfather – his first name was Victor, right? -- stepped into your life and provided a model and an influence and an impact that only God could use to imprint your life.  You had a conversation with him outside a courtroom that really impacted your life.

Byron:  That’s right.  I was around five years old, and we were in a courtroom.  It was in Mississippi, and it was a hot summer day.  I was out in the little foyer of the courtroom on a bench that looked like a pew.  I can remember it like it was yesterday.  He knelt down in front of me and he said, “Would you like to be my son?” to which I said, “I didn’t know I wasn’t, but of course.”  

And I think whether biological or adoptive, a lot of fathers fail to make that connection clear.  So it was an enormous blessing.  I mean I got it; it clicked, and I always valued that relationship as a result of it.

Bob:  He went from that question into the courthouse and formalized the adoption.

Byron:  That was it.  I mean, that was the moment, and there are so many doctrines that ...

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Defining Manhood for Your Son

Guest:                         Byron Yawn             

From the series:       What Every Man Wishes His Father Had Told Him 

Bob:  As a dad, how much time do you spend correcting your boys versus the time you spend affirming and encouraging them?  Here’s pastor and author Byron Yawn:

Byron:  I tell my sons all of the time – I observe these things in them – I’ll tell them, “Son, you’re so gifted in this area.”  I will dialog with them about it and I’ll help them see it.  It encourages them along.  In doing that, I’m helping him to have self-awareness:  where he’s deficient, where he’s good, where he needs to grow, where there are struggles in his soul that he’s going to deal with for the rest of his life, just to have an awareness of these things.

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Wednesday, May 30th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.    Every son is longing to hear words of affirmation from his father.  Are you generous with that or stingy?  We’re going to talk more about it today.  

Welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thank you for joining us.  If I were to scan your iPod – do you have any music on your iPod?

Dennis:  What’s it to you?

Bob:  I just want to know what you would have been listening to.  

Dennis:  It’s personal.  What?

Bob:  What might you have been listening to in recent days?  Here’s my real question . . . 

Dennis:  Andrew – Andrew Peterson.

Bob:  OK.  Alright.  That’s good.  You get a high five from me for that.

Dennis:  It might not be on my iPad, but it is – what’s it on?  

Bob:  It’s on a cassette!  Do you have a cassette?

Dennis:  No, no, it’s not on a cassette!

OK, if you want to do that - would you share with our listeners what you did; what you tweeted?  You want to tell them what you tweeted?

Bob:  What?  

Dennis:  If you want to play this game, you know what?  I know the Bible says not to give insult for insult, but this is just having some good times and fun.  We’ve got a pretty good crowd out in the outer area of our studio.  This is a good eye-witness.

Bob:  This actually involves our guest.  Did you know that?

Dennis:  Does it really?

Bob:  Yes, I was on my way to Nashville, and I was going to try to hook up with our guest who is a pastor in Nashville.  Can I introduce him?

Dennis:  You can.

Bob:  Byron Yawn joins us on FamilyLife Today.  Byron, welcome.

Byron:  Huge privilege to be here, guys!  Thank you.

Bob:  Byron is the pastor of Community Bible Church in Nashville.  He’s an author and a speaker.  I was trying to send a direct message to Byron.  I was trying to send him a direct message to say, “Hey, give me a call on my cell phone so we can figure out where we’re going to have lunch!”  (Laughter)

But it didn’t go as a direct message.  It went to the whole twittersphere.  It was my phone number.

Dennis:  He tweeted his cell phone number.

Bob:  Have we had enough of this?

Dennis:  We have, we have!

Byron Yawn has written a book called What Every Man Wishes His Father Had Told Him.

Bob:  The reason I was asking you about your iPod was because he’s got a list in here of what he calls Man Laws, right?

Byron:  Man Laws, right.  You may never refer to clothing as an “outfit.”

Bob:  On you!  You can call your wife’s clothing an outfit, right?  Can’t you say, “That’s a nice outfit” for her?

Byron:  Technically, yes, but you could also use other terms if you just wanted to be safe.

You can’t ever say “outfit.”

If you have something on your shoe . . .

Bob:  On the heel.

Byron:  On the heel, and somebody says, “Hey, you’ve got something on your shoe back there,” you can’t do the pirouette thing and look back.  There’s no way to look masculine doing that.

Bob:  Where you look over your shoulder?

Byron:  No.  See, that’s just – it gives me the willies.

Bob:  That I even pretended like I was doing it.  (Laughter)

Byron:  You’ve got to pick your heel up in front of you.  (Bob demonstrates)

There you go, that’s how you do it!

Dennis:  The one before it was good, too:  “You must be able to locate at all times the duct tape in your house when asked.”

Bob:  You have to know exactly where it is and be able to lay your hands on it in about five seconds.

Dennis:  That’s a man-tool; that’s a man-tool.

Well, your book is about manhood and real identity of manhood.  If you were asked to really give us the essence of what true manhood is all about, what real masculinity is all about, how would you answer the question?

Byron:  The question really isn’t what is manhood as much as what does manhood look like when Christ is in it?  I think that one of the observations that I’ve made in my own life is that when I come across books on Biblical manhood or being a man, you know as a Christian – being a Christian father and Christian husband – that we point to all kinds of examples.  Some are biblical - Moses and otherwise, and some are historic, but rarely do I find a chapter on Jesus. 

I think, without a doubt, that Jesus is the definition of what it means to be a Christian man, a biblical man.

Bob:  Okay, but you know that there are women who are listening who are saying, “So is ...

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“Coupleness” Doesn’t Equal “Familyness”

Guests:                      Ron Deal, Rob & Rhonda Bugh, Sabrina Beasley                     

From the series:       Dating and the Single Parent 

Bob:  Rhonda Williams lost her husband, Tom, to cancer after more than two decades of marriage.  Her pastor, Rob Bugh, lost his wife to cancer, as well.  Months later, Rob and Rhonda got married.

Rhonda:  We really thought we were prepared for remarriage, but we still— 

Rob:  We were naïve.  We were much more focused on the chemistry between us than the chemistry of that dynamic with our kids.

Rhonda:  It was difficult for our children to understand, especially how you could love somebody else.

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Monday, October 15th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.  It’s possible for two spiritually-mature, committed believers in Christ to walk into a second marriage unprepared and to be surprised at what they find.  We’ll hear about that today.  Stay tuned.  

Bob:  And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us.  Have you ever been at an amusement park where you’ve gone on a ride and you thought, “That was a fun, exciting ride; and I never want to go on that ride again.”

Dennis:  Absolutely!

Bob:  Have you ever had that happen?

Dennis:  I have, yes.

Bob:  That’s how Mary Ann and I have talked about dating.  It was a fun and exciting thing, and we hope we never have to go on that ride again; you know?

Dennis:  Right.  It is an experience that is meant to be once in a lifetime; but for a number of people, they have to date more than once.  Now, I’m not talking about dating your spouse after you get married.  We’re talking about what happens after a divorce, after the death of a spouse.

We’ve got some guests who, not only have solutions, but have some fascinating stories around the whole concept of being single again and dating.  Our friend, Ron Deal, joins us on FamilyLife Today.  Ron is brand-new to the staff of FamilyLife.  He’s not new to our listeners.  They’ve heard him on FamilyLife Today on multiple occasions.  Ron is married to his wife, Nan, since 1986.  They have three sons.  He is heading up a new ministry, here, at FamilyLife, targeting blended families.

Ron, first of all, welcome to the broadcast.  I’ll introduce our other guests in just a moment.  Share with our listeners a little bit about what you hope to do through FamilyLife’s blended family outreach.

Ron:  Well, thank you, Dennis.  It’s always a pleasure to be on FamilyLife Today with you and Bob.  We endeavor to try to equip blended family couples to go the distance.  We want the marriage that they’re in to be their last.  The couples that are listening right now, who are in stepfamilies, know exactly what I’m talking about.  

By death or by divorce—some script that they did not choose to write—they now find themselves in a different family situation.  We want to try to help them understand their family, make sense of what’s going on, and create it into a home that is a redemptive home.  I really believe, very strongly, that stepfamilies can be homes of redemption—stop the cycle of divorce with this generation—make a difference in the emotional, spiritual, and psychological lives of their children so that they have the ability to grow, trust the Lord, and live vibrant lives of their own.   

Dennis:  And out of that heart, you’ve written a brand-new book called Dating and the Single Parent.  We’re going to be talking about that in a few moments.  Also joining us is Sabrina Beasley.  She used to work, here, at FamilyLife.  She gave birth to her first child and went home to be a stay-at-home mom and had a second child.  Then, in 2010, her husband was killed in a car wreck; and she became a single parent.  She has agreed to come in and share a little of her story and kind of how that whole process is going currently.  Sabrina, welcome to the broadcast.

Sabrina:  Thank you, Dennis.  Thank you for having me today.

Dennis:  And then we have Rob and Rhonda Bugh from Wheaton, Illinois.  Rob, Rhonda, welcome to the broadcast.

Rhonda:  Thank you.

Rob:  Thanks, Dennis.  It’s great to be here.

Dennis:  Rhonda is a pediatrician and has been for 28 years.  Rob has been a pastor—pastor of Wheaton Bible Church for—how many years?

Rob:  Eighteen.

Dennis:  Eighteen years.  Together, they have six children—six adult children—and one teenager.  The unique side of their story is Rhonda’s husband, Tom, was Rob’s best friend.  He died of cancer in 2005.  Then, in 2005 and 2006, Rob’s wife fell prey to cancer, as well, and died.  Interestingly, they started dating and remarried.  We’ve got their story that we’re going to be illustrating what Ron is talking about—from his book. 

Ron, in America this year, there should be a million—approximately a million—marriages.  How many of those will be remarrieds?

Ron:  Right.  About 45 percent of them will be remarrieds.  Now, the majority of those remarriages will also include children from previous relationships.  So, about 40 percent of all weddings will give birth to a stepfamily.  

Bob:  Interestingly, one of the things you talk about, in your book on Dating and the Single Parent, is that, in a first-time marriage, the marriage forms the foundation on which the family is built.

Ron:  Right.

Bob:  But when there are already kids present and then there’s a remarriage, it’s a different kind of home; isn’t it?

Ron:  It’s a different kind of home, and it has a different sort of foundation.  For that couple to put their relationship into a place of being the foundation of the new step-family home is one of those long-term agendas that they need to have to bring stability.  During the dating season, the challenges are many.

I say it this way, Bob:  Dating, as a single—never-married, no kids—dating anoth...

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Blending Your Family Traditions

Guests:                      Ron Deal and Bob and Vicki Maday                     

From the series:       Stepfamilies and Holidays 

Bob:  Bob and Vicki Maday married late in life.  Both had lost a spouse; and Bob says neither of them were prepared for the impact the holidays would have on their attempt to blend a new family.  

 Bob M:  We had taken some lead, as we were getting counseled in our remarriage, that we would try to start some new traditions.  We made every effort to make new things sort of happen in our new family.  The interesting thing that happened was—when it came to Christmas—that tradition sort of superseded anything else that we had expected.  We were put under pressure to hold the tradition in place, and it was quite interesting.  

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Monday, December 17th.  Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.  If you are in a blended family and you’re headed into the holidays for the first time, get ready.          

And welcome to FamilyLife Today.  Thanks for joining us on the Monday edition.  I’m just curious.  You’ve had a number of pictures taken of your family over the years; right?  

Dennis:  Right.  

Bob:  To your knowledge, any airbrushing ever done?  

Dennis:  Oh, absolutely.  [Laughter]  Photoshop, airbrushing—you can’t get a family perfect—I mean, in real life or in photography.  

Bob:  So, those Christmas pictures I’ve been getting through the years bear only a marginal resemblance to the real thing—— is what you’re saying.  

 Dennis:  When I introduce my family and I show a picture, I say, “You know how we got that picture?  We photo-shopped in two children”—

Bob:  Right.  

Dennis:  —“who weren’t even in the picture at the time.  We opened the eyes of two or three kids who never can seem to keep their eyes open during a picture.”  And I say, “You know what?  There is a reason for that because all families have their blemishes.”  

Bob:  Well, you had to take a couple hundred shots to get one where everybody was looking at the camera; right?  

Dennis:  Well, this was back in the days when you used to take, like, ten rolls.  

Bob:  I remember rolls.  

Dennis:  Hundreds—

Bob:  Yes, I remember rolls.  

Dennis:  —hundreds of pictures to get a good one.  I won’t tell you which one of our kids, but we had one—this child was called “The Many Faces of Blank”.  I mean, if there was a way to make a strange-looking face,—

Bob:  This child could do it.  

Dennis:  —this child did it.  I’ve done a good job of protecting the identity, at this point.  

 Bob:  The reason I ask you if you’ve ever had anything airbrushed is because this is going to be one of those non-airbrushed days—

Dennis:  Oh, yes.  

Bob:  —as we talk about the holidays, and families, and challenges, and tensions, and, particularly, how those can emerge during the holiday season if you’re in a remarriage or a blended family situation.  

Dennis:  That’s exactly right, Bob.  We’re sitting here about to have a conversation about blended families because listeners came alongside FamilyLife and said, “We’re going to donate, and we’re going to make this ministry possible.  We want this outreach to reach all families.”  That’s really what I want to talk to you about, here, at the beginning of the broadcast.  FamilyLife is facing a serious shortfall in donations.  I just need to ask you, as a listener, “If you’ve benefited personally from our broadcast, here on FamilyLife Today, would you stand with us with a donation, here at yearend?”  

We’ve had a group of families that have come along side us and said, “We believe in what you are doing.  You’ve helped us, and we want to help other families.”  They’ve helped establish a $3.6 million match—here in December—that will match every dollar you give, up to $3.6 million.  You can go online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY and make a donation.  You can help us take advantage—take full advantage of the $3.6 million match, here in December.   Your dollar can become two.  Help us so we can help you—and we can help your friends.  

 Bob:  Well, again, go online to make a donation at FamilyLifeToday.com.  Click the button that says, “I CARE”; or call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY.  We just want to say, “Thanks,” in advance, for whatever you are able to do in support of the ministry of FamilyLife Today.  
 
Now, you want to introduce our guests who are going to be joining us today?  

Dennis:  I do.  First of all, is Ron Deal.  He is the Director of Blended Family Ministries, here at FamilyLife—is a prolific author, has written a brand-new book.  In fact, Ron, explain to our listeners what Life in a Blender is all about.  It’s subtitled Living in a Stepfamily, a guide for kids.  

Ron:  Well, first of all, it’s great to be back on the broadcast with both of you.  As you know, our blended family ministry endeavors to equip blended families—stepfamilies—to go the distance, to build families of grace that honor God and create a climate where children can grow to know the Lord and to be loved.  

We’ve written a number of materials, books.  We have DVD’s for adults.  We’ve never done anything for kids until now.  Life in a Blender: Living in a Stepfamily is a booklet designed for children—easy-to-read booklet for kids, ages 10 and up.  It comes with a free parent discussion guide.  The idea is to get your kid thinking about a few things that they’re probably feeling—put some words on it—then, give parents an opportunity to interact with their child around that—

Dennis:  Yes.  

Ron:  —and create dialogue that let’s both of them understand each other better and move forward, as a family.  

Dennis:  You’ve got more than 25...

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How to Avoid Becoming a Wicked Stepmother

Guests:                      Ron Deal and Laura Petherbridge                         

From the series:       The Smart Stepmom 

Bob:   If you’re a stepmom, you may be able to relate to what Laura Petherbridge is describing here.

Laura:  You’d be amazed at the number of stepmoms that have contacted me—emailed me and said, “When I pull in the driveway of my home, and I know the step-kids are there, I feel exactly the same way as I did when I would pull into my home when I was married to an abusive husband.”  That’s that kind of fear that is triggered in them—it’s that same feeling of: “I’m out of control. There are people, here, who are hurting me. I feel ostracized. I feel lonely. I feel like I’m being taken advantage of, and I’m going to retreat.”

Bob:  This is FamilyLife Today for Tuesday, May 7th. Our host is the President of FamilyLife®, Dennis Rainey, and I’m Bob Lepine. What do you do when you’re a stepmom and the thought of just going home makes you tense up?  We’re going to talk about that today. Stay tuned.

And welcome to FamilyLife Today. Thanks for joining us. Have you ever thought about the fact that, in a lot of cartoons, the character that is the personification of evil is a stepmother?  Have you ever thought about that? 

Dennis:  I haven’t.

Bob:  I mean, Cinderella—it’s the wicked stepmother; in what was it?—Sleeping Beauty—I think, a wicked stepmother. I don’t know how it got into our literature and our popular culture to be that way; but nobody thinks, “Gee, the stepmom—she’s the noble person.” We’ve got the stereotype of the wicked stepmother.

Dennis:  It causes me to wonder if those fairy tales were written by someone who grew up in a home where they had a stepmom; and maybe, that’s the best word they could use to describe their stepmother. Well, we have the authors of a brand-new book called The Smart Stepmom.

Bob:  Not the wicked stepmom.

Dennis:  No.

Bob:  The smart stepmom.

Dennis:  No, but one of the authors described herself as a wicked stepmother. Laura Petherbridge—she’s the one who did that.

Laura:  I did!

Dennis:  You described yourself.

Laura:  I did. I’m very honest.

Dennis:  I’ve never really ever introduced a guest, since we started this in 1992, Bob, as—[Laughter] 

Bob:  We want to welcome our wicked stepmother to our program. [Laughter]

Dennis:  Here she is on FamilyLife Today. And Ron Deal joins us. I’m not sure how to introduce you, Ron. But you both have a lot of experience in this area of step-parenting. Let’s talk about that for a second. You refer to yourself—in fact, you thought you’d never become the wicked stepmother.

Laura:  Yes, it really sounds bad, but the reason I put that in the book is because I want other stepmoms to understand that it’s normal to feel that way. I can remember looking in the mirror, one day, thinking, “What have I become?” because I was feeling so wicked about all the issues that we were dealing with, as a family, and some of the emotions I was having towards my step-kids.

Dennis:  Like what?

Laura:  Well, just some days, wishing that their mother would move to another state; and I wouldn’t have to see them for six months. It’s a terrible thing to even say; but if I’m being totally honest—and I’m speaking for a lot of stepmoms that contact me—their desire is that the step-kids would move far, far away so you just wouldn’t have to deal with it all the time.

Dennis:  So you want them out of your life.

Laura:  Exactly; exactly. I know that sounds very un-Christian. It doesn’t sound very loving; but if we’re being honest, that is often the thought that is going across the stepmom’s mind: “This is so much more complicated than I thought it was going to be. Maybe, if they just weren’t here, it wouldn’t be so difficult.”

Dennis:  I don’t think I’ve ever admitted this on FamilyLife Today, but I think Barbara and I had some days with our kids—

Bob:  I was thinking the same thing. [Laughter]

Dennis:  If there had been a box to have checked—“Could there be a chance of our kids moving away—for, maybe, six hours?” Maybe, it wasn’t six months.

Bob:  There were times when we sent them off to summer camp and just said, “Thank you, Lord, for summer camp—just for a little breather, here!”

Dennis:  I can really understand, Laura, although I’ve, obviously, never been a step- parent. I can understand how that would create all kinds of guilty feelings and shame that you even have the thought.

Laura:  Absolutely, because, I think—as a biological parent—when you think that, there is a part of you that knows that’s a little bit normal—but as a stepmom—there’s a part, in particular if you’re a Christian—there’s a feeling inside of you that you know that you don’t love these children in exactly the same way you either love your own children or you love your own family members. There’s a guilt that goes along with that. 

So it’s different than the biological parent, you know—being glad that the kids are going off to camp—because it’s just a different family dynamic.

Ron:  I think part of this guilt is rooted in self-blame. Stepmoms are really hard on themselves.

Laura:   Yes.

Ron:  As Laura and I did the research for this book and talked with stepmoms, we developed a team of stepmoms, who advised us about different aspects of the book. That’s one of the things we heard over, and over, and over again. In my counseling with stepfamilies—is this sense of blame. 

Stepmoms try so very hard. If they keep kind of beating their head against a wall, and can’t quite get into a child’s heart, or can’t quite figure out how to deal with the power issues in being a parent and so on, they really, really struggle. Oftentimes, they just feel so isolated and alone. They don’t know what else to do—they kind of blame themselves.

Bob:  Here’s a scenario I imagine. Tell me if this is kind of a typical ...

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How Blended Families Function

Guests:                      Steve and Misty Arterburn and Ron Deal             

From the series:       Blended Family Tips 

Bob: When Steve and Misty Arterburn married, they brought children into the newly-formed blended family, but Steve says they wanted to make sure that the children knew what their relationship with their new mom and dad was all about.

Steve: We did not want to be step-parents—step-parents get stepped on. We wanted to be a bonus into their lives, so we claim ourselves as bonus parents and kind of come at it as a benevolent aunt or uncle would, in the very beginning, and earn their respect and ask permission, really, to be in their lives.

Bob: This is FamilyLife Today for Thursday, April 5th. Our host is Dennis Rainey; I'm Bob Lepine. We’ll hear from Steve and Misty Arterburn today about some of the things they learned as they blended a family together—some of the challenges they faced along the way. Stay with us.

1:00

And welcome to FamilyLife Today. Thanks for joining us. We’re going to tackle a subject today that can be a little difficult to navigate. Our listeners know that we urge couples to keep their covenant / to stay married. Sometimes couples, for reasons that are beyond themselves, their marriages don’t survive. That puts them in a position to go, “Okay; what do I do now?” We have some friends who are going to help have that conversation with us today.

Dennis: We do. Steve and Misty Arterburn join us on FamilyLife Today. Misty/Steve, welcome back.

Misty: Thank you so much.

Steve: Thank you. It’s great to be here.

Dennis: You guys both experienced divorce separately; and then began to date and, ultimately, got married. The thing that really resonates with Bob and me is that you brought your church into your relationship—

2:00

Steve: Right.

Dennis: —to bring a sense of biblical judgment, and sound advice, and counsel as you established this relationship.

Bob: Well, and as you guys start to talk about this, we should acknowledge, as well, that our friend, Ron Deal, is joining us today.

Dennis: I wasn’t ignoring him. [Laughter]

Bob: I know you weren’t, but I wanted our listeners to know he’s in the studio with us. Ron gives leadership to the blended family initiative, here, at FamilyLife. We thought this is a conversation you need to be in on with us—nice to have you here.

Ron: Glad to be here. Certainly glad to be with the Arterburns.

Steve: Yes; we hope we represent a smart stepfamily for you. [Laughter]

Dennis: Well said—well said.

Ron: I think you do.

Steve: No; we really did, from the beginning, work with our pastors on overcoming some obstacles. Both of us felt like we met the biblical criteria for divorce and for remarriage, and that was kind of the foundation first.

Misty: We had a lot of people speaking into our lives—we invited a lot of people into our relationship—but also each of our own individual healing paths that we were on. 

3:00

When you start dating someone, you don’t know if this is going to end up in a marriage. The main goal was just for me to continue being healthy, and healing, and growing, and raising my boys to be healthy, and strong, and healing as well. Steve was on a path like that.

Bob: Well, here’s the way I think about the kind of situation both of you were in. I follow pro sports. I know, sometimes, a guy will sustain an injury that knocks him out for the season. He has to go to the doctors; he has to get bones reset; he has a lot of work that has to happen / there’s some rehab that has to happen. The doctors want to make sure that, before they even think about him being back in the game, he’s not going to tear something fresh.

Misty: Right; yes.

Steve: Right.

Bob: So, when your first marriages ended, you were where all people are in that moment—you were hurting and out of the game for a while. 

4:00

Misty: Yes.

Bob: What was the process of beginning rehab and realignment for you during those first few months after the divorce happened?

Misty: Well, it was a bit like walking off of a cliff. I mean, I didn’t know if I’d survive it either. I cried every day, for about four years, during the process and after the divorce—a lot of pain / a lot of pain. 

I had a mentor—a female mentor in the church—and we met regularly. She, not only covered me in prayer, but just gave me daily practical advice and encouragement. The elders of my church were involved—they were looking out for me. I went two cycles through the divorce care recovery material, which was phenomenal and very, very healing. I just got into a community of people that are: everybody healing—and we’re all looking at our wounds, and we’re getting input, and we’re humbling down. It was a time when, actually, spiritually, it’s a really precious time in my life.

5:00

You know, going through it was horrific; but it is a treasure to me now. I lived in the Psalms, and I just prayed those prayers, and I had experienced God in a new way. I couldn’t know Him as a comforter at the level that I met Him during that very, very dark season. Those were some of the things I did.

Steve: Yes; and when I met Misty—I just met her one time. I didn’t ever talk with her for a long time after that; but as we did get to know each other, a year or so later, I was so impressed by her connection in church, and with her pastors, and mentors. We swapped counselors before we decided we could get married.

But for me, you know, I was surrounded by all these—the best Christian counselors—like Henry Cloud, John Townsend, and all these other folks—and then I went to see a counselor. 

6:00

I had an assistant who said: “By the way, you need to get some help. You look really bad,”—and I did. It was the darkest time of my life—the pain. 

I discovered something so strang...