In this first bonus episode of That Workplace Experience Podcast, host Dan Moscrop is joined by Simon Jordan and Gerry Hopkinson of We Make Progress — a design anthropology and experience strategy studio working across cities, venues and mixed-use developments.

Together, they explore a provocative idea:

What if we’ve been designing workplaces the wrong way around?

From fluid identity and hybrid work to the limits of “human-centric design,” this conversation challenges the assumption that efficiency equals growth.

They unpack:

• The “Explore vs Exploit” theory of work
• Why meaning matters more than corporate purpose
• Why buildings shouldn’t organise people
• How participation and stewardship shape long-term success
• Why places should behave more like living ecologies than static systems

This episode steps back from a single project to examine the cultural forces reshaping work, cities and experience today.

Watch the episode and download the Workbook for a deeper dive into the episode, and We Make Progress. 

Video production and camera: Calum Lindsay

Camera: Miguel Santa Clara

Illustration: Phoebe Gitsham