Tom Griffiths is joined by Julie Dirksen, a celebrated author and learning strategy consultant. In part two of their discussion, Tom and Julie delve into the practical application of behavior change design principles in L&D initiatives. They discuss how to conduct more effective audience research, ways to measure behavior change, and getting buy in from learners. Julie pulls from her deep knowledge of behavioral science and learning design as showcased in her bestselling book "Design For How People Learn" and her recent work "Talk to the Elephant: Design Learning for Behavior Change."