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But What About...Angels - Part 1
Episode 124 – But What About … Angels
Welcome to Anchored by Truth brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. In John 14:6, Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life.” The goal of Anchored by Truth is to encourage everyone to grow in the Christian faith by anchoring themselves to the secure truth found in the inspired, inerrant, and infallible word of God.
Script:
This salvation was something even the prophets wanted to know more about when they prophesied about this gracious salvation prepared for you. They wondered what time or situation the Spirit of Christ within them was talking about ... It is all so wonderful that even the angels are eagerly watching these things happen.
1 Peter, chapter 1, verses 10 through 12, New Living Translation
********
VK: Hello. I’m Victoria K and today on Anchored by Truth we are continuing our latest study series brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. We’ve labeled this series “But what about” because a lot of time that’s how the questions about the Christian faith start. As we’ve noted before, Christianity is a faith that is firmly rooted in place and time. But that doesn’t mean that Christianity doesn’t have a supernatural dimension. It does. So, often when people encounter the supernatural aspect of the Christian faith they will ask questions like, “but what about angels and demons” or “but what about heaven and hell?” These are usually subjects that are familiar to most people, but which are actually poorly understood. So, we want to do individual episodes on several of these subjects to see what the Bible actually has to say about them. I’m in the studio today with RD Fierro, author and Founder of Crystal Sea Books. RD, why did you decide we should do this what about series?
RD: Well, hello to all the Anchored by Truth listeners. Thank you for joining us here today. As you mentioned there are a lot of subjects that pertain to the Christian faith where knowledge about them in our culture is a mile wide but an inch deep. Sometimes I think there is more misinformation that circulates around these subjects than actual information. Much of the confusion can be directly traced back to a lack of Biblical literacy in our culture. That’s the bad news. The good news is most of the confusion can be eliminated simply by going to back to the Bible to see what it has to say. Reading the Bible not only will clarify our views on the supernatural elements of Christianity but it is also an excellent cure for a vast variety of the ills that confront our faith and society.
VK: That’s one of the things that distinguishes Christianity from other religions. Christianity is comfortable both in the here and now. But Christianity is also comfortable in the realms that can’t be perceived by our five senses. A lot of people would like to deny that those realms exist but we all know that they do. As the Nicene Creed states, “We believe in one God, Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen.”
RD: Yes. As Romans 1:18 through 20 says: But God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness. … Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.”
VK: That’s from the New Living Translation. The Contemporary English Version has that same section as “From heaven God shows how angry he is with all the wicked and evil things that sinful people do to crush the truth. ... God's eternal power and character cannot be seen. But from the beginning of creation, God has shown what these are like by all he has made. That's why those people don't have any excuse.”
RD: Yes. So, the point the Apostle Paul is making is that everyone knows that God exists. When they try to deny that truth they have to “suppress” or “crush” that truth. But, as that verse also says God, cannot be perceived directly with our five senses. God is a supernatural being. God is the ultimate supernatural being. So, as Christians we affirm both the existence of the natural universe – the universe that we can see with our eyes, ears, and other senses. But we also affirm the existence of an unseen realm. We perceive the unseen realm by applying logic and reason to evidence we can obtain from the natural world we can see. For instance, the 2nd law of thermodynamics tells us that the visible universe is burning through its available supply of usable energy. This means that the universe cannot be infinitely old because otherwise it would have run out of energy. No matter how much energy the universe has it burns a certain percentage every year. And no matter how many years it might last an infinite number would still be a bigger number.
VK: A simple way of stating the dilemma is that “the universe cannot explain its own origin or existence.” But the existence of an eternal, personal, creative Being can explain the origin and existence of the universe. That’s what the verse from Romans means. We can know about God’s power and character by applying the logic and intelligence God has given us to the grandeur we see about us.
RD: Yes. And by applying logic and intelligence we can determine that the Bible is God’s special revelation to people. And part of that special revelation is that the unseen, the supernatural realm, contains other beings than just God.
VK: Such as angels and demons?
RD: Right. We know from the Bible that God has created two categories of intelligent, personal beings: men and angels. And we know that those two categories have some things in common but that they are also vastly different.
VK: Well, before we move on to that part of the discussion let’s just be precise on one point. You said the Bible tells us that God has created two categories of intelligent, personal beings: men and angels. I’m sure some people wonder whether God could have created other categories of such beings?
RD: He could have, but we have no evidence that He did. When it comes to contemplating the supernatural aspects of creation some speculation is probably inevitable. But the danger in speculating is that we become so enamored with our speculations we lose sight of what we do or can know to be true. Provided we’re solidly grounded in the truth, exercising what John Gerstner used to call our “sanctified imaginations” can help us think through questions thoroughly. But we always need to be sure that we don’t invest our trust in anything that is the product of those imaginations. When I see the titles of a lot of books it’s obvious that many writers have elevated the products of their own imaginations over the very real realms made by the Creator.
VK: I think that’s a good caution to keep in mind. So, today we want to begin our look at angels. As we’ve already noted, angels are one of two categories of intelligent, personal beings that the Bible discusses. What else do we know about angels? For instance, when were angels created?
RD: That’s a very good question. There’s not universal agreement among scholars as to when angels were created. Some scholars believe that angels were created at the same time as God created everything else. Dr. Jonathan Sarfati, in his commentary on Genesis entitled The Genesis Account, says that whenever the words “heavens and earth” are linked together in Old Testament Hebrew that this is a figure of speech called a “merism.”
VK: A merism is a figure of speech in which two opposites are joined together into an all-encompassing whole. We do the same thing in English when we say things like the store is open day and night. We don’t mean the store is only open when it’s bright sunshine or dark. We mean the store is open all the time. Other merisms include “searched high and low” or “we checked near and far.”
RD: Yes. So, Dr. Sarfati’s point is that Genesis 1:1 which says that “in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth” includes the creation of both the visible and invisible realms, both the physical and the non-physical. But there are other scholars who believe that the angels were created before the physical creation. And they point to Job 38 verses 4 through 7 as support for this view.
VK: Those verses are where God is confronting Job and pointing out the limits of Job’s knowledge. God says to Job, “Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? Tell me, if you know so much. Who determined its dimensions and stretched out the surveying line? What supports its foundations, and who laid its cornerstone as the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy?” That’s the New Living Translation.
RD: Right. Now, it’s pretty obvious that if the angels shouted for joy when God laid the foundations of the earth the angels were already in existence. But many scholars believe that part of Job is just a poetic expression and is not meant to be taken literally. So, the question of when angels created is a bit of an open question, but it is clear that angels were in existence either before man or they came into existence no later than man. Some commentators see the angels being created at the same time as the heavens and earth. But God may have created angels early on the first day they would still have been around to see the rest of creation, including the creation of man on day 6.
VK: So, there is not agreement on the exact time that angels were created but there is agreement that the angels all possessed some form of free will and that they were initially created, like man, in a probationary status. After all, demons are just fallen angels. The demons obviously elected to use their freedom to choose in an unholy way and rebel against God. In effect, they violated their probation. As a consequence, they were expelled from their original place in heaven. But the holy angels didn’t misuse their freedom. The holy angels remained faithful and loyal to their Creator.
RD: Yes. So, let’s make a couple of other observations at this point. Angels were created in a fully mature state. Ordinarily angels don’t have a physical presence, though at times some do take on some form of a corporeal structure. Since angels were created fully developed there was no need for angels to “grow up.” They were formed in their final state, which means, that upon creation, they were fully able to exercise their capabilities. As you said, the fallen angels used their free will to rebel against God and the holy angels used their free will to be obedient to God. God has affirmed that choice by allowing each group to retain that status they chose for eternity.
VK: The New Geneva Study Bible puts it this way for the holy angels: “The many who passed the [probationary] test are now evidently confirmed in a state of holiness and immortal glory. Heaven is their dwelling place where they constantly worship God and from where they go out at God’s command to render service to Christians.”
RD: So, just as the holy angels are confirmed in a state of holiness, the unholy angels are confirmed in a state of permanent damnation. But both groups have an intense interest in what happens on the earth especially with Christians. One aspect of the angels’ personality is apparently curiosity. As we heard in our opening quotation, 1 Peter 1:12 says that even angels long to look into [the] things pertaining to salvation and the gospel.
VK: So, like people angels are personal, intelligent beings. But unlike people angels ordinarily exist as spirits not as beings of flesh and blood. The fact that angels are not physical in their nature also implies that angels don’t age or die like human beings do. Jesus confirmed this in his exchange with the Sadducees in Mark, chapter 12 when he said that after the resurrection people are like the angels and don’t marry and aren’t given in marriage. Now, it’s important to note in that passage that Jesus said that after the resurrection believers will be like the angels in certain respects. Jesus did not say that believers become angels. The idea that believers are transformed into angels after death is an idea that’s contained in books and movies but it is completely unbiblical.
RD: Great point. No matter how charming It’s a Wonderful Life is as a movie, human beings and angels are completely different orders of created beings. People will always be people. We might be people in heaven who will have glorified bodies. That’s the same kind of body Jesus had after He came out of the tomb. Or, sadly, some people will be people in hell who will suffer for all eternity. But we will always be people.
VK: Of course, there’s no need for anyone to suffer in hell especially not anyone who is listening to Anchored by Truth. All anyone has to do is turn to Jesus, acknowledge they have sinned, and ask Jesus to save them. Jesus saves everyone who asks Him to and there’s nothing Jesus wants more than to save everyone with a salvation that is full and free.
RD: Another great point. We certainly hope and pray that anyone listening to this program who has not already trusted in Jesus to be their Savior will immediately turn to Him. None of us are guaranteed another hour much less another day or decade. The time to be saved is always now. At any rate people will always be people and angels will always be angels whether they are fallen or unfallen. But it is also true that at certain times and for certain reasons angels have been able to take on the appearance of being human. So, that’s where some of the confusion about humans becoming angels or angels becoming human may have arisen.
VK: Well, before we get to specific instances of what angels did in the Bible, are there any other things we should note about what angels are?
RD: Well, thus far we’ve seen that angels are the second category of created beings that are intelligent and personal. Angels were fully formed and mature upon their creation. They didn’t start out as baby angels and have to grow up. Angels don’t age or die.
VK: In that respect the only two people that were created like that were Adam and Eve. They were created as fully mature adults, but every other person has had to undergo a maturation process. That’s true for all higher order species of plants and animals on earth. To paraphrase an old observation even the mighty oak starts out as an acorn.
RD: Right. But angels don’t. Ordinarily, angels do not have a corporeal presence so there’s no need for them to mature physically and ordinarily they are intangible and unseen. But this does not mean that the physical parameters of our universe do not have some impact on the activities of angels. For instance, in Daniel, chapter 10, we have the famous episode of an angel being sent by God to provide an answer to Daniel’s prayer. But the angel did not arrive instantaneously. Apparently some travel was involved.
VK: Daniel 10:12 and 13 says, “Then [the angel] said, “Don’t be afraid, Daniel. Since the first day you began to pray for understanding and to humble yourself before your God, your request has been heard in heaven. I have come in answer to your prayer. But for twenty-one days the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia blocked my way. Then Michael, one of the archangels, came to help me, and I left him there with the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia.”
RD: So, the angel didn’t just pop instantaneously from one location to another.
VK: Apparently there’s no teleportation or “beaming” in the angelic realm.
RD: Apparently not. But we have no way of knowing in what manner or at what speeds they move in their realm or how their movement in the unseen realm relates to time and distance in our universe. Here is where a bit of sanctified speculation seems to indicate that they likely aren’t confined by the laws of physics either in their realm or ours. So, the speed limits that affect travel here probably don’t apply to them. They can probably cross distances in time frames that would make us dizzy but that still doesn’t mean they are immune to all of the constructs of the physical creation.
VK: And our verse from Daniel shows us something else. It seems that there is a hierarchical system within the angelic realm. The messenger sent to Daniel was blocked by the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia until Michael, one of the archangels, came to help him. That would seem to indicate that the “spirit prince of Persia” had more power than the messenger but not as much as Michael. Do we know how many levels there are in this hierarchy?
RD: Not really. Some commentators think Paul, in his epistles, referred to the ranks of angels using the terms, "principalities," "powers," "thrones," "dominions," and "powers." The first four are apparently used in a good sense in Colossians 1:16, where it is said that all these beings were created through Christ and unto Him; but, in most of the other passages in which words from this group occur, they seem to represent evil powers. But other than knowing for sure that Michael is referred to as an “archangel” or a “chief prince” we don’t have any solid information as to how the angelic hierarchies are ordered.
VK: So, this is probably a good time to make another note for today about the angelic realm. There are apparently various types or groups of angels but we are given titles for only two of those in the Bible: the Seraphim and Cherubim. There are over 60 references in the Bible to Cherubs or Cherubim but only 2 references to Seraphim. The term Seraphim means “burning” or “glowing.” The only references to Seraphim are in Isaiah chapter 6 where they are said to be around the throne of God. They have six wings. They fly with two and use two wings to cover their feet and two to cover their faces. Covering their feet is a display of modesty and apparently they cover their faces because even the holy angels cannot bear to gaze into the refulgent glory of God almighty.
RD: That’s a great lesson for us. God is so magnificent that even these powerful angels are awed and intimidated by His presence. But this does not drive them away from God. They remain in His presence just in a posture of perpetual worship. When we approach God we should be reverent and respectful of God’s absolute holiness as they are. So, the only reference to Seraphim mentions them as being in the immediate presence of God. By contrast, the Cherubim (the plural of cherub) seem to be an order of angels tasked with representing God or performing missions for God on this earth. The first mention of them is when they were placed outside the Garden of Eden to act as guards and keep man from re-entering it.
VK: But cherubim are mentioned in many other places as well. And cherubim adorned the mercy seat which was the top of the famous Ark of the Covenant. One of the most amazing appearances of cherubim is in Ezekiel chapters 1 and 10 where their appearance is described as a creature with four wings, four faces, human hands, but straight legs that ended in calf-like hooves and they were shining and glowing. It’s hard to know what to make of an appearance like that.
RD: Yes, it is, especially since the cherubim that adorned the mercy seat didn’t look anything like that. Many commentators have offered explanations for why the cherubim in Ezekiel had that bizarre (to our eyes) appearance but I don’t want to get too diverted by that right now. The major point is that angels can seem to appear in various guises that are suitable for the occasion. And since angels ordinarily do not possess physicality it’s probably best not to try to press them into a specific mold the way we do the appearances of creatures on our world. And one final point we need to make on today’s show is that despite the large number of angels that various people encountered in the Bible we know the names of only two.
VK: We know the archangel Michael and the messenger Gabriel. The name Michael means “who is like God.” The name Gabriel means “God is my strength.” But this does not include the names of angels mentioned in the Apocrypha does it?
RD: No. It does not. The Apocrypha are not considered to be canonical by most Protestant churches so the Roman Catholics and some of the Orthodox traditions do accept them as canonical. So, other angelic names such as Raphael and Uriel do appear in either the Apocrypha or some other ancient literature. Some lists contain as many as 8 named angels, but among the 66 books of the Bible generally used by Protestants only Michael and Gabriel are named.
VK: Does this mean that other angels do not have names or that we just don’t know them?
RD: I would lean more toward the side that other angels do have names but they’re just not recorded in the Bible. In Luke 8:30 (Mark 5:9) there is the well-known encounter between Jesus and a man who was possessed by demons. In speaking to the demons, Jesus asks “what is your name?” Now, if other angels didn’t have names, there would have been no point in Jesus asking the question. By the way I don’t for one minute think Jesus needed the answer to the question but his disciples did. And notice that the name the demons, plural in this case, gave was not a personal name but a descriptive one: legion – because there were many of them in the man. This may indicate that angels may sometimes identify themselves in ways other than the use of a personal name – perhaps by a function or an attribute.
VK: Well, that’s not actually uncommon. In many countries at one time people used names that were tied to their occupation. For instance, Carpenter, Shoemaker, or Baker were common names at one point. And even today either names or nicknames are tied to an attribute or a physical feature. Well, today we’ve spent most of our time talking about the nature and characteristics of angels. In our next episode of Anchored by Truth we’re going to talk about what angels do or at least what they did in the Bible. The goal of this discussion is to help people see that the Bible is consistent throughout its entire text, even though that text was compiled over a period of 1,500 years. The remarkable unity of the Bible is evidence of the Bible’s own supernatural point of origin. Sounds to me like a good time for a prayer. Today's prayer comes from another one of Crystal Seas’ offerings, the book Purposeful Prayers and is a prayer of adoration for the Creator who made and sustains the entire universe and each of us:
---- PRAYER FOR PERSECUTED CHRISTIANS (TREY).
We hope you’ll be with us next time and we hope you’ll take some time to encourage some friends to tune in too, or listen to the podcast version of this show.
If you’d like to hear more, try out crystalseabooks.com where “We’re not famous but our Boss is!”
(Bible Quote from the New Living Translation)
1 Peter, chapter 1, verses 10 through 12, New Living Translation
Topical Bible: Angel (biblehub.com)
Relevant extract from the Biblehub article:
In New Testament the word aggelos, when it refers to a Divine messenger, is frequently accompanied by some phrase which makes this meaning clear, e.g. "the angels of heaven" (Matthew 24:36). Angels belong to the "heavenly host" (Luke 2:13). In reference to their nature they are called "spirits" (Hebrews 1:14). Paul evidently referred to the ordered ranks of supra-mundane beings in a group of words that are found in various combinations, namely, archai, "principalities," exousiai, "powers," thronoi, "thrones," kuriotetes, "dominions," and dunameis, also translated "powers." The first four are apparently used in a good sense in Colossians 1:16, where it is said that all these beings were created through Christ and unto Him; in most of the other passages in which words from this group occur, they seem to represent evil powers. We are told that our wrestling is against them (Ephesians 6:12), and that Christ triumphs over the principalities and powers (Colossians 2:15; compare Romans 8:38 1 Corinthians 15:24). In two passages the word archaggelos, "archangel" or chief angel, occurs: "the voice of the archangel" (1 Thessalonians 4:16), and "Michael the archangel" (Jude 1:9).
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Episode 124 – But What About … Angels
Welcome to Anchored by Truth brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. In John 14:6, Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life.” The goal of Anchored by Truth is to encourage everyone to grow in the Christian faith by anchoring themselves to the secure truth found in the inspired, inerrant, and infallible word of God.
Script:
This salvation was something even the prophets wanted to know more about when they prophesied about this gracious salvation prepared for you. They wondered what time or situation the Spirit of Christ within them was talking about ... It is all so wonderful that even the angels are eagerly watching these things happen.
1 Peter, chapter 1, verses 10 through 12, New Living Translation
********
VK: Hello. I’m Victoria K and today on Anchored by Truth we are continuing our latest study series brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. We’ve labeled this series “But what about” because a lot of time that’s how the questions about the Christian faith start. As we’ve noted before, Christianity is a faith that is firmly rooted in place and time. But that doesn’t mean that Christianity doesn’t have a supernatural dimension. It does. So, often when people encounter the supernatural aspect of the Christian faith they will ask questions like, “but what about angels and demons” or “but what about heaven and hell?” These are usually subjects that are familiar to most people, but which are actually poorly understood. So, we want to do individual episodes on several of these subjects to see what the Bible actually has to say about them. I’m in the studio today with RD Fierro, author and Founder of Crystal Sea Books. RD, why did you decide we should do this what about series?
RD: Well, hello to all the Anchored by Truth listeners. Thank you for joining us here today. As you mentioned there are a lot of subjects that pertain to the Christian faith where knowledge about them in our culture is a mile wide but an inch deep. Sometimes I think there is more misinformation that circulates around these subjects than actual information. Much of the confusion can be directly traced back to a lack of Biblical literacy in our culture. That’s the bad news. The good news is most of the confusion can be eliminated simply by going to back to the Bible to see what it has to say. Reading the Bible not only will clarify our views on the supernatural elements of Christianity but it is also an excellent cure for a vast variety of the ills that confront our faith and society.
VK: That’s one of the things that distinguishes Christianity from other religions. Christianity is comfortable both in the here and now. But Christianity is also comfortable in the realms that can’t be perceived by our five senses. A lot of people would like to deny that those realms exist but we all know that they do. As the Nicene Creed states, “We believe in one God, Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen.”
RD: Yes. As Romans 1:18 through 20 says: But God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness. … Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.”
VK: That’s from the New Living Translation. The Contemporary English Version has that same section as “From heaven God shows how angry he is with all the wicked and evil things that sinful people do to crush the truth. ... God's eternal power and character cannot be seen. But from the beginning of creation, God has shown what these are like by all he has made. That's why those people don't have any excuse.”
RD: Yes. So, the point the Apostle Paul is making is that everyone knows that God exists. When they try to deny that truth they have to “suppress” or “crush” that truth. But, as that verse also says God, cannot be perceived directly with our five senses. God is a supernatural being. God is the ultimate supernatural being. So, as Christians we affirm both the existence of the natural universe – the universe that we can see with our eyes, ears, and other senses. But we also affirm the existence of an unseen realm. We perceive the unseen realm by applying logic and reason to evidence we can obtain from the natural world we can see. For instance, the 2nd law of thermodynamics tells us that the visible universe is burning through its available supply of usable energy. This means that the universe cannot be infinitely old because otherwise it would have run out of energy. No matter how much energy the universe has it burns a certain percentage every year. And no matter how many years it might last an infinite number would still be a bigger number.
VK: A simple way of stating the dilemma is that “the universe cannot explain its own origin or existence.” But the existence of an eternal, personal, creative Being can explain the origin and existence of the universe. That’s what the verse from Romans means. We can know about God’s power and character by applying the logic and intelligence God has given us to the grandeur we see about us.
RD: Yes. And by applying logic and intelligence we can determine that the Bible is God’s special revelation to people. And part of that special revelation is that the unseen, the supernatural realm, contains other beings than just God.
VK: Such as angels and demons?
RD: Right. We know from the Bible that God has created two categories of intelligent, personal beings: men and angels. And we know that those two categories have some things in common but that they are also vastly different.
VK: Well, before we move on to that part of the discussion let’s just be precise on one point. You said the Bible tells us that God has created two categories of intelligent, personal beings: men and angels. I’m sure some people wonder whether God could have created other categories of such beings?
RD: He could have, but we have no evidence that He did. When it comes to contemplating the supernatural aspects of creation some speculation is probably inevitable. But the danger in speculating is that we become so enamored with our speculations we lose sight of what we do or can know to be true. Provided we’re solidly grounded in the truth, exercising what John Gerstner used to call our “sanctified imaginations” can help us think through questions thoroughly. But we always need to be sure that we don’t invest our trust in anything that is the product of those imaginations. When I see the titles of a lot of books it’s obvious that many writers have elevated the products of their own imaginations over the very real realms made by the Creator.
VK: I think that’s a good caution to keep in mind. So, today we want to begin our look at angels. As we’ve already noted, angels are one of two categories of intelligent, personal beings that the Bible discusses. What else do we know about angels? For instance, when were angels created?
RD: That’s a very good question. There’s not universal agreement among scholars as to when angels were created. Some scholars believe that angels were created at the same time as God created everything else. Dr. Jonathan Sarfati, in his commentary on Genesis entitled The Genesis Account, says that whenever the words “heavens and earth” are linked together in Old Testament Hebrew that this is a figure of speech called a “merism.”
VK: A merism is a figure of speech in which two opposites are joined together into an all-encompassing whole. We do the same thing in English when we say things like the store is open day and night. We don’t mean the store is only open when it’s bright sunshine or dark. We mean the store is open all the time. Other merisms include “searched high and low” or “we checked near and far.”
RD: Yes. So, Dr. Sarfati’s point is that Genesis 1:1 which says that “in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth” includes the creation of both the visible and invisible realms, both the physical and the non-physical. But there are other scholars who believe that the angels were created before the physical creation. And they point to Job 38 verses 4 through 7 as support for this view.
VK: Those verses are where God is confronting Job and pointing out the limits of Job’s knowledge. God says to Job, “Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? Tell me, if you know so much. Who determined its dimensions and stretched out the surveying line? What supports its foundations, and who laid its cornerstone as the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy?” That’s the New Living Translation.
RD: Right. Now, it’s pretty obvious that if the angels shouted for joy when God laid the foundations of the earth the angels were already in existence. But many scholars believe that part of Job is just a poetic expression and is not meant to be taken literally. So, the question of when angels created is a bit of an open question, but it is clear that angels were in existence either before man or they came into existence no later than man. Some commentators see the angels being created at the same time as the heavens and earth. But God may have created angels early on the first day they would still have been around to see the rest of creation, including the creation of man on day 6.
VK: So, there is not agreement on the exact time that angels were created but there is agreement that the angels all possessed some form of free will and that they were initially created, like man, in a probationary status. After all, demons are just fallen angels. The demons obviously elected to use their freedom to choose in an unholy way and rebel against God. In effect, they violated their probation. As a consequence, they were expelled from their original place in heaven. But the holy angels didn’t misuse their freedom. The holy angels remained faithful and loyal to their Creator.
RD: Yes. So, let’s make a couple of other observations at this point. Angels were created in a fully mature state. Ordinarily angels don’t have a physical presence, though at times some do take on some form of a corporeal structure. Since angels were created fully developed there was no need for angels to “grow up.” They were formed in their final state, which means, that upon creation, they were fully able to exercise their capabilities. As you said, the fallen angels used their free will to rebel against God and the holy angels used their free will to be obedient to God. God has affirmed that choice by allowing each group to retain that status they chose for eternity.
VK: The New Geneva Study Bible puts it this way for the holy angels: “The many who passed the [probationary] test are now evidently confirmed in a state of holiness and immortal glory. Heaven is their dwelling place where they constantly worship God and from where they go out at God’s command to render service to Christians.”
RD: So, just as the holy angels are confirmed in a state of holiness, the unholy angels are confirmed in a state of permanent damnation. But both groups have an intense interest in what happens on the earth especially with Christians. One aspect of the angels’ personality is apparently curiosity. As we heard in our opening quotation, 1 Peter 1:12 says that even angels long to look into [the] things pertaining to salvation and the gospel.
VK: So, like people angels are personal, intelligent beings. But unlike people angels ordinarily exist as spirits not as beings of flesh and blood. The fact that angels are not physical in their nature also implies that angels don’t age or die like human beings do. Jesus confirmed this in his exchange with the Sadducees in Mark, chapter 12 when he said that after the resurrection people are like the angels and don’t marry and aren’t given in marriage. Now, it’s important to note in that passage that Jesus said that after the resurrection believers will be like the angels in certain respects. Jesus did not say that believers become angels. The idea that believers are transformed into angels after death is an idea that’s contained in books and movies but it is completely unbiblical.
RD: Great point. No matter how charming It’s a Wonderful Life is as a movie, human beings and angels are completely different orders of created beings. People will always be people. We might be people in heaven who will have glorified bodies. That’s the same kind of body Jesus had after He came out of the tomb. Or, sadly, some people will be people in hell who will suffer for all eternity. But we will always be people.
VK: Of course, there’s no need for anyone to suffer in hell especially not anyone who is listening to Anchored by Truth. All anyone has to do is turn to Jesus, acknowledge they have sinned, and ask Jesus to save them. Jesus saves everyone who asks Him to and there’s nothing Jesus wants more than to save everyone with a salvation that is full and free.
RD: Another great point. We certainly hope and pray that anyone listening to this program who has not already trusted in Jesus to be their Savior will immediately turn to Him. None of us are guaranteed another hour much less another day or decade. The time to be saved is always now. At any rate people will always be people and angels will always be angels whether they are fallen or unfallen. But it is also true that at certain times and for certain reasons angels have been able to take on the appearance of being human. So, that’s where some of the confusion about humans becoming angels or angels becoming human may have arisen.
VK: Well, before we get to specific instances of what angels did in the Bible, are there any other things we should note about what angels are?
RD: Well, thus far we’ve seen that angels are the second category of created beings that are intelligent and personal. Angels were fully formed and mature upon their creation. They didn’t start out as baby angels and have to grow up. Angels don’t age or die.
VK: In that respect the only two people that were created like that were Adam and Eve. They were created as fully mature adults, but every other person has had to undergo a maturation process. That’s true for all higher order species of plants and animals on earth. To paraphrase an old observation even the mighty oak starts out as an acorn.
RD: Right. But angels don’t. Ordinarily, angels do not have a corporeal presence so there’s no need for them to mature physically and ordinarily they are intangible and unseen. But this does not mean that the physical parameters of our universe do not have some impact on the activities of angels. For instance, in Daniel, chapter 10, we have the famous episode of an angel being sent by God to provide an answer to Daniel’s prayer. But the angel did not arrive instantaneously. Apparently some travel was involved.
VK: Daniel 10:12 and 13 says, “Then [the angel] said, “Don’t be afraid, Daniel. Since the first day you began to pray for understanding and to humble yourself before your God, your request has been heard in heaven. I have come in answer to your prayer. But for twenty-one days the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia blocked my way. Then Michael, one of the archangels, came to help me, and I left him there with the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia.”
RD: So, the angel didn’t just pop instantaneously from one location to another.
VK: Apparently there’s no teleportation or “beaming” in the angelic realm.
RD: Apparently not. But we have no way of knowing in what manner or at what speeds they move in their realm or how their movement in the unseen realm relates to time and distance in our universe. Here is where a bit of sanctified speculation seems to indicate that they likely aren’t confined by the laws of physics either in their realm or ours. So, the speed limits that affect travel here probably don’t apply to them. They can probably cross distances in time frames that would make us dizzy but that still doesn’t mean they are immune to all of the constructs of the physical creation.
VK: And our verse from Daniel shows us something else. It seems that there is a hierarchical system within the angelic realm. The messenger sent to Daniel was blocked by the spirit prince of the kingdom of Persia until Michael, one of the archangels, came to help him. That would seem to indicate that the “spirit prince of Persia” had more power than the messenger but not as much as Michael. Do we know how many levels there are in this hierarchy?
RD: Not really. Some commentators think Paul, in his epistles, referred to the ranks of angels using the terms, "principalities," "powers," "thrones," "dominions," and "powers." The first four are apparently used in a good sense in Colossians 1:16, where it is said that all these beings were created through Christ and unto Him; but, in most of the other passages in which words from this group occur, they seem to represent evil powers. But other than knowing for sure that Michael is referred to as an “archangel” or a “chief prince” we don’t have any solid information as to how the angelic hierarchies are ordered.
VK: So, this is probably a good time to make another note for today about the angelic realm. There are apparently various types or groups of angels but we are given titles for only two of those in the Bible: the Seraphim and Cherubim. There are over 60 references in the Bible to Cherubs or Cherubim but only 2 references to Seraphim. The term Seraphim means “burning” or “glowing.” The only references to Seraphim are in Isaiah chapter 6 where they are said to be around the throne of God. They have six wings. They fly with two and use two wings to cover their feet and two to cover their faces. Covering their feet is a display of modesty and apparently they cover their faces because even the holy angels cannot bear to gaze into the refulgent glory of God almighty.
RD: That’s a great lesson for us. God is so magnificent that even these powerful angels are awed and intimidated by His presence. But this does not drive them away from God. They remain in His presence just in a posture of perpetual worship. When we approach God we should be reverent and respectful of God’s absolute holiness as they are. So, the only reference to Seraphim mentions them as being in the immediate presence of God. By contrast, the Cherubim (the plural of cherub) seem to be an order of angels tasked with representing God or performing missions for God on this earth. The first mention of them is when they were placed outside the Garden of Eden to act as guards and keep man from re-entering it.
VK: But cherubim are mentioned in many other places as well. And cherubim adorned the mercy seat which was the top of the famous Ark of the Covenant. One of the most amazing appearances of cherubim is in Ezekiel chapters 1 and 10 where their appearance is described as a creature with four wings, four faces, human hands, but straight legs that ended in calf-like hooves and they were shining and glowing. It’s hard to know what to make of an appearance like that.
RD: Yes, it is, especially since the cherubim that adorned the mercy seat didn’t look anything like that. Many commentators have offered explanations for why the cherubim in Ezekiel had that bizarre (to our eyes) appearance but I don’t want to get too diverted by that right now. The major point is that angels can seem to appear in various guises that are suitable for the occasion. And since angels ordinarily do not possess physicality it’s probably best not to try to press them into a specific mold the way we do the appearances of creatures on our world. And one final point we need to make on today’s show is that despite the large number of angels that various people encountered in the Bible we know the names of only two.
VK: We know the archangel Michael and the messenger Gabriel. The name Michael means “who is like God.” The name Gabriel means “God is my strength.” But this does not include the names of angels mentioned in the Apocrypha does it?
RD: No. It does not. The Apocrypha are not considered to be canonical by most Protestant churches so the Roman Catholics and some of the Orthodox traditions do accept them as canonical. So, other angelic names such as Raphael and Uriel do appear in either the Apocrypha or some other ancient literature. Some lists contain as many as 8 named angels, but among the 66 books of the Bible generally used by Protestants only Michael and Gabriel are named.
VK: Does this mean that other angels do not have names or that we just don’t know them?
RD: I would lean more toward the side that other angels do have names but they’re just not recorded in the Bible. In Luke 8:30 (Mark 5:9) there is the well-known encounter between Jesus and a man who was possessed by demons. In speaking to the demons, Jesus asks “what is your name?” Now, if other angels didn’t have names, there would have been no point in Jesus asking the question. By the way I don’t for one minute think Jesus needed the answer to the question but his disciples did. And notice that the name the demons, plural in this case, gave was not a personal name but a descriptive one: legion – because there were many of them in the man. This may indicate that angels may sometimes identify themselves in ways other than the use of a personal name – perhaps by a function or an attribute.
VK: Well, that’s not actually uncommon. In many countries at one time people used names that were tied to their occupation. For instance, Carpenter, Shoemaker, or Baker were common names at one point. And even today either names or nicknames are tied to an attribute or a physical feature. Well, today we’ve spent most of our time talking about the nature and characteristics of angels. In our next episode of Anchored by Truth we’re going to talk about what angels do or at least what they did in the Bible. The goal of this discussion is to help people see that the Bible is consistent throughout its entire text, even though that text was compiled over a period of 1,500 years. The remarkable unity of the Bible is evidence of the Bible’s own supernatural point of origin. Sounds to me like a good time for a prayer. Today's prayer comes from another one of Crystal Seas’ offerings, the book Purposeful Prayers and is a prayer of adoration for the Creator who made and sustains the entire universe and each of us:
---- PRAYER FOR PERSECUTED CHRISTIANS (TREY).
We hope you’ll be with us next time and we hope you’ll take some time to encourage some friends to tune in too, or listen to the podcast version of this show.
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(Bible Quote from the New Living Translation)
1 Peter, chapter 1, verses 10 through 12, New Living Translation
Topical Bible: Angel (biblehub.com)
Relevant extract from the Biblehub article:
In New Testament the word aggelos, when it refers to a Divine messenger, is frequently accompanied by some phrase which makes this meaning clear, e.g. "the angels of heaven" (Matthew 24:36). Angels belong to the "heavenly host" (Luke 2:13). In reference to their nature they are called "spirits" (Hebrews 1:14). Paul evidently referred to the ordered ranks of supra-mundane beings in a group of words that are found in various combinations, namely, archai, "principalities," exousiai, "powers," thronoi, "thrones," kuriotetes, "dominions," and dunameis, also translated "powers." The first four are apparently used in a good sense in Colossians 1:16, where it is said that all these beings were created through Christ and unto Him; in most of the other passages in which words from this group occur, they seem to represent evil powers. We are told that our wrestling is against them (Ephesians 6:12), and that Christ triumphs over the principalities and powers (Colossians 2:15; compare Romans 8:38 1 Corinthians 15:24). In two passages the word archaggelos, "archangel" or chief angel, occurs: "the voice of the archangel" (1 Thessalonians 4:16), and "Michael the archangel" (Jude 1:9).