In the is episode we sit down with Zen priest , and Executive director of Hollow Bones Zen founded by Jun Po Dennis Kelly and founder of "Your Turn Meditative Living"
To talk about the dark paths of spirituality and the potential pitfalls of finding true teachers and teachings as well as the difficulty that sometimes accompanies the path towards self realization. We also discuss the recent incident regarding the Dalai Lama and offer some perspectives.

To find out more about Umi's work and take advantage of a half-priced membership offer good until the end of 2023  for CDR listeners visit  YourturnML.com   
To find our more about Umi's work in Zen check out Hollowboneszen.org