Christopher Drew, author of the definitive book on submarine espionage past and present, talks with Jeff Stein. And we dig into the new bestseller The Bin Laden Papers with author and New America Senior Fellow Nelly Lahoud.

Guests:
Christopher Drew
https://www.facebook.com/chris.drew.9250
https://twitter.com/nytdrew
https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/23829.Christopher_Drew

Nelly Lahoud
https://www.newamerica.org/our-people/nelly-lahoud/
https://yalebooks.co.uk/display.asp?K=9780300260632

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Deep Dive

SpyTalk lives at the intersection of intelligence operations, foreign policy, homeland security, and military strategy. Hosted by veteran national security journalist Jeff Stein, the podcast features exclusives by SpyTalk’s roster of longtime reporters, news and profiles of US and foreign spymasters, and interviews with policymakers and expert authors. There’s nothing quite like it—a place for experts and laypersons alike, who enjoy national security scoops and insights by SpyTalk's subject matter experts. 
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News

Government

Fat Leonard was “a maritime fixer who provided harbor protection, barges, cranes, food, fresh water, sewage collection, and anything else a nuclear powered aircraft carrier might need.” It’s absolutely astonishing how easily Leonard corrupted so many ranking Navy officers by providing them with prostitutes, booze, cash and airline tickets.

HOW THE NCIS FAILED BIG WITH FAT LEONARD

Middle East hand Jonathan Broder talks about the convoluted intelligence relationship between Jerusalem and Washington with host Jeff Stein.

There are friendly nations, but no friendly intelligence services, goes an old saw in the spy business. What that means in practicality is that we have close intelligence relationships with our allies, but in many cases, we also spy on each other, not entirely trusting what they’re telling us.  In no place is this convoluted arrangement better exemplified than the security relationship between US and Israel, who have a long history of snooping on each other while closely working together on mutual targets, like Iran and its allied militias, like Hezbollah in Lebanon, the Houthis in Yemen, and now, Hamas in Gaza.

US-ISRAELI SPY WARS

Jason Leopold, a senior reporter with Bloomberg News, has literally been getting under the skin of government bureaucracies for decades. His weapon: The Freedom of Information Act, enacted by Congress in the mid-1960s because the feds, well, had an insidious propensity to bury embarrassing, or even illegal, acts under layers of official secrecy. Over the years the law has been strengthened—not that it’s stopped the government from continuing its bad behavior.

The Man Who Gets the Secrets

Last month’s spectacular terrorist attack on a concert venue on the outskirts of Moscow, which left 144 people dead, was quickly followed by startling news that US intelligence had warned the Russians about the impending assault. When the Kremlin said the warnings hadn’t been specific, moreover, US officials pushed back, saying, in effect, “Oh yes they were,” and added details to its rejoinder. Likewise, it turned out that back in January, US intelligence had warned Iran about an impending Islamic State terrorist attack at a gathering to honor its fallen Quds Force leader Qasem Soleimani, who had been killed by a US drone strike in Baghdad.  

The revelations that our spy services had actually warned two of our greatest mortal enemies astounded many people and triggered a lot of acidic commentary, confusion and the inevitable conspiracy theories on social media. 

Today’s guest, former CIA case officer and base chief Laura Thomas, who held a number of senior intelligence positions during her nearly 16 years of government service, says those actions followed a standard practice in American intelligence. It’s called “a duty to warn.” And she’s here to explain how that seemingly esoteric, even confounding, practice is not only a staple of the spy world—at least on the American side—but it has some espionage benefits as well.

Tipping Off Our Enemies to Terrorist Attacks

New SpyTalk Contributing Editor Mike Isikoff pokes holes in 60 Minutes’ blockbuster story.

Deep Dive

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