The Bible talks about death as the wages of sin, and as an enemy to be defeated. This is in great contradiction to those who have seen death as "natural", or even a good thing that liberates humanity from the evil of the material world. Even within the Church opinions have varied. Ambrose talked about death, the end of this present life, as a good, "death is a harbor of peace for the just," while Augustine spoke of it in book XIII of the City of God this way: "But a question not to be shirked arises: Whether in very truth death, which separates soul and body, is good to the good? For if it be, how has it come to pass that such a thing should be the punishment of sin? For the first men would not have suffered death had they not sinned. How, then, can that be good to the good, which could not have happened except to the evil? Then, again, if it could only happen to the evil, to the good it ought not to be good, but non-existent. For why should there be any punishment where there is nothing to punish?" Christopher Neiswonger and Lindsay Brooks talk about death--the death of the body, death to sin, the second death, the death of Lazarus, and the death of Christ.