Michael Anton is a lecturer and research fellow at Hillsdale College, a senior fellow at the Claremont Institute, and a former national security official in the Trump and George W. Bush administrations. He has also served in the administrations of California Governor Pete Wilson and New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani.

James R. Otteson is the John T. Ryan Jr. Professor of Business Ethics, the Honors Program Faculty Director, and a CCCG faculty fellow at the University of Notre Dame. He received his BA from the Program of Liberal Studies at the University of Notre Dame and his PhD in philosophy from the University of Chicago.

Visit CCCG: www.constudies.nd.edu

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The views and opinions expressed are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect the University of Notre Dame, the College of Arts and Letters, or the Center for Citizenship and Constitutional Government.

Recorded March 24, 2023 at the University of Notre Dame