On this episode of The Permanent Problem podcast, Brink Lindsey welcomes Damon Linker, author of the "Notes from the Middleground" Substack and a Niskanen Center senior fellow, to discuss the challenge of right-wing populism and how liberals should respond to it. After exploring the twists and turns of Linker's intellectual development, the two examine the rise of the populist right, debate the causes of its rise, and evaluate its intellectual defenders. They also address the cleavage within liberalism exposed by the populist uprising: the conflict between "brokenists" and "non-brokenists." The former see populism as a misguided response to real and serious problems in contemporary liberal societies, whereas non-brokenists respond that conceding the existence of serious problems is uncalled for and lends undeserved credibility to populism. Linker and Lindsey side with the brokenists, arguing that liberal democracy is undergoing a legitimacy crisis that can be defused only if we first recognize the scale of public disaffection and identify its sources.