Change is scary, how do you keep people from resisting? While at the DevOps Enterprise Summit in London, Richard sat down with fellow Kiwi Rob England to talk about his experiences bringing DevOps practices to very conservative organizations - like the New Zealand government! The conversation starts out with the idea that DevOps is not just for unicorns, that is, companies that are all about leading edge technologies. DevOps works for horses too, it just has to be approached the right way.