🎙️ Dining With Donna Podcast: Interview with Debra Erickson, Founder, The Blind Kitchen | Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA https://donnajodhan.com/dwd-02-17-2026/

In this inspiring episode of Dining With Donna, Donna J. Jodhan welcomes Debra Erickson, founder of The Blind Kitchen, for a candid conversation about vision loss, resilience, and reclaiming confidence in the kitchen. Debra shares her journey from a shocking diagnosis of retinitis pigmentosa at age 28 to learning essential blindness skills and fully embracing her identity, while Donna connects through her own experience of having to re-learn cooking without relying on sight. Together, they explore Debra's core message: vision loss does not have to end your love of cooking, and with the right support, techniques, and mindset, fear can be replaced with competence and joy.

Debra explains how her frustrations with inaccessible online cooking content, especially videos that offered no useful description, pushed her to build The Blind Kitchen as a structured, one-stop teaching hub with extensive audio-described instructional resources. She and Donna dig into practical, immediately usable strategies: setting up a clean, predictable work area (trays, a scraps bowl, and a "parked" spot for sharp tools), preventing cross-contamination with warm soapy sink water, and adopting family-friendly safety systems like a dedicated sharps basket. Debra highlights favorite tools that replace visual cues with sound and touch (like a boil-alert disc and auto-measuring spout), plus methods for labeling and identification from low-tech (rubber bands) to higher-tech options (Be My Eyes, Aira, Meta smart glasses). The episode closes with a forward-looking note as Debra shares her hope to build more community and connection through cook-alongs and shared learning, so no one has to navigate blind cooking alone.

TRANSCRIPT

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Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Dining with Donna, the podcast where we make cooking approachable, enjoyable, and accessible to everyone. I'm your host, Donna Jordan, and I am inviting you into my kitchen today to explore step by step recipes, smart kitchen hacks, and more meal ideas that fit real life. Whether you are cooking on a budget, planning a busy weeknight dinner, or preparing something special for family and friends, will focus on cooking with confidence without relying on sight, using sound, touch, aroma and simple tools that keep you safe and in control. So grab your apron, bring your curiosity, and let's get cooking. Debra Ericksen it is my privilege and my pleasure to welcome you to my podcast.

Debra Erickson: Well, thank you for the kind introduction. I'm very excited to be here and to have this conversation with you.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Great. So let's get started, Debra, for listeners who are meeting you for the very first time, can you share your story of vision loss when you first notice symptoms when you were diagnosed and what that transition was like for you personally and professionally.

Debra Erickson: Well, I was diagnosed with retinitis pigmentosa when I was 28, and I had just gone to the eye doctor to get a pair of glasses because I had astigmatism, a mild one since I was a child. Yeah. And when he looked in my eyes and said, I think you have an eye disease, and I want you to see a specialist, I couldn't have been more shocked. There was no history of vision loss in either side of my family. And I'm one of 12 children and there was absolutely no, no history. So I ended up going and it was confirmed. So my parents were recessive gene carriers, but I had no symptoms that I was aware of. Of course I had decreased peripheral vision and I had I knew I couldn't see very well in the dark, but how much can another person see in the dark? So I had no suspicion at all that I had a serious eye disease. And so, like many people who have RP, some people call it resistant people. That's what RP stands for. I tried to fake it as long as I could. I did not want to identify as blind. It just it wasn't part of my identity. And I came to the point where I couldn't anymore. I was falling down, getting hurt, knocking things over, apologizing to shopping carts. And so I done a lot of that. So I went to the Oregon Commission for the blind, and that's where I got my blind skills and started accepting that this was indeed part of who Debra Erickson was. And that included the word blind.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: What a hard knock.

Debra Erickson: You know, we've all got something. It's just this that nobody gets out of here without. Without stuff. So.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah. Let's talk about the heart of your mission. Your mission? That vision loss does not have to end your love of cooking. Okay. What do you say to someone who tells you quotation mark? I used to love cooking, but now I am afraid.

Debra Erickson: Well, first of all, I relate to them. When I first took my me, my first meal prep class at the Oregon Commission for the blind, and I had to stand in front of a stove and they completely blindfolded me just to make sure I wasn't using my available vision so that I would get immersed in the whole experience. I was terrified, absolutely Terrified because I saw the little vision left and I. But but once it was taken away from me. So I know that fear. But my instructor was lovely and she was very calming and and had me helped me develop a trust in her. And so when people say they're afraid, I'm like, you're right to be afraid. That kitchen can be a very dangerous place. You can cut yourself. You can burn yourself. Yeah. You can, you can look clumsy, you know, you can look disorganized. It is a scary place. But if you have the right tools and techniques and information, you still can cook. You just have to do it differently. Because our world relies on vision, we have a very visual world. So when that is either eliminated or reduced significantly, things have to change. And that is part. And cooking is one of those things. You can do it, but you just have to do it differently.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And that's that's very true. I mean, I mean, I had functional vision up until about 20 years ago, and I had to readjust and thank God I had my mom alongside me to, you know, say to me, keep on going, girl, this is how you're going to do it from now on, you know, so I understand.

Debra Erickson: Yeah. It's important to have, you know, some cheerleaders along the way because it can be pretty frustrating and pretty, you know, depressing. And so it's nice if you have support groups or some type of, of people along the way that can help you readjust your attitude when it needs it. Because we all need it occasionally.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: We sure do. One thing that really stands out about The Blind Kitchen is your library of audio described instructional videos. How did you decide to invest so heavily in teaching content. And what do you think makes a cooking demo truly useful to someone who can't rely on sight?

Debra Erickson: So when I was in culinary school, I had to solve a lot of problems. I was the only blind student, and so I would go on the internet at night and, you know, to study for the next day. How can I flip an egg? How can I know if this pan is centered on the stove? How can I, you know, measure things without wasting it because you get points deducted from you? And so I had to solve a lot of problems, and I can't tell you how frustrating it was to find a YouTube video with the perfect title. And then all of a sudden it's just music. I just wanted to pull my hair out. And that happens a lot, where you get the perfect title or the perfect video and it's not accessible to us. So when I started, when I was deciding on what The Blind Kitchen would be, it could be just a cooking show with a, you know, a twist on vision loss. Or it could be, you know, a podcast where I talk to other people with vision loss that like to cook. But but Donna, in my core, I'm a teacher and I that's that's who I, my most authentic person is.

Debra Erickson: And so I decided it wouldn't be an entertaining website. It would be a teaching website where I could share the information that I had learned in my journey. I didn't create all of these systems and tools and things like that. A lot. I had a lot of teachers helping me to to learn how to solve different problems. And the Blind Kitchen became that place where instead of finding things in different places on the internet or on a blog or in an article, The Blind Kitchen became and the library specifically. So the tools Are the the bread and butter for The Blind Kitchen. That's how we pay our bills and keep keep the the website going. But the the the library is the heart of The Blind Kitchen. There are so many tips and tools and strategies. And there are like 12 different ways to label things from low tech to high tech. And so we discuss it. It depends on your wallet. It depends on your comfort with technology. So it's nice to have choices. And I just love the library in The Blind Kitchen. It really has grown immensely.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And you've had to invest a lot of time and finances in all of this, haven't you?

Debra Erickson: I absolutely have you. We film in a in a professional studio, and so there's all the costs that go along with that. The script writing, the, you know, props and food, you know, things that are related to it. But I have a an excellent team and we just turned three in October. Where from where we opened our website doors. And so the growth has been pretty amazing. It was slow at first, but now all of a sudden it's it's been exponential. It's been quite the journey.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Wow I am impressed. Now you serve so many different learners kids, teens, adults who lost lost vision later in life. How does your teaching change depending on the age and life stage of the cook? And what are your best tips for families who want to teach a blind child how to cook with confidence?

Debra Erickson: Okay, so each of those populations I would call that you mentioned each person has to be approached as an individual. They have a history. Some have cooked before and now they lost vision and they're not sure how to proceed. Others have never even been in a kitchen before. And I want to address the child thing. And I know this is a passion of yours as well. Yes, but they children with vision loss. The parents are amazing, but what they want to do is keep their kids out of the kitchen, many of them, because that's a dangerous place, you know, they can get cut and burned and it's their job to protect their children. But in end, there's no funding or or classes for for sighted parents of children with vision loss. I mean, I suppose there are some here and there, but it's not a thing at this point in time. So I actually am I it'll be it's my third one where I'm doing a zoom presentation to school districts, and the target audience is not the visually impaired children, it's the parents of visually impaired children. So the the child accompanies them or the young adult. And then I teach different ways that the parents can make their kitchen accessible. Introduce them to tools. So if they have a child as young as three, can use some of my tools safely to cut up bananas, to cut up the slicer that that can't cut their skin, but it can cut through a banana.

Debra Erickson: And I have quite a few tools like that, but the but the parents just don't know how. And so I and the other thing is, is a lot of people think it's very expensive to renovate a kitchen to make it accessible. And then what happens to the people that can see the notification? How are they going to manage. So but these are ways that they I teach them ways they can mark their flat screen, you know appliances and things like that with, like, maybe a bump dot or maybe a halo or maybe, you know, different, different inexpensive, low tech. And the people in the family that can see can still use it. It's just very it's remarkably easy. But if you don't have the information, you can't be expected to just know it. And so this the course is called The Kitchen is for everyone. And so the the parents are supplied with a certain amount of tools. And then I go through and teach them the different tools, how their kids can use them, but also things that they can do that have nothing to do with, with tools specifically to make their kitchens accessible for their child with vision loss.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I think this is absolutely amazing because when I think back and I have I had sighted parents. I know that my mom and my granny were petrified to let me into the kitchen. Absolutely. No, you can't do you can't even lift a dishcloth, you know. But I was very determined to ensure that I got in there and that I learned how to cook. And eventually I convinced them, you know, so it takes a lot of work.

Debra Erickson: It does, because parents are so protective and well-meaning, and that's how they love their children, is to protect them. But if you can give them an alternative route where they can still love and protect their children and help them make their way towards becoming independent adults, that's a better answer.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Absolutely. Now, you also emphasize smart systems for safety, like, you know, like what to do with knives in the sink and how to avoid surprise cuts. Can you share a few of your most effective safety routines that listeners can adopt immediately?

Debra Erickson: Yeah, so the first thing I think is to have a safe, clean, predictable work area. And I we can talk about that if you want to go into it. But there's a couple of things people can do immediately. If you are cooking with vision loss and you're using a cutting board or a work tray or whatever, and let's say you're fabricating chicken or or cracking eggs or whatever, and now your fingers have some bacteria on them. It's just chicken juice right now, but it will if it's at room temperature for any length of time. Cross-contamination can occur because harmful bacteria can grow. So if you're going to wash off your fingers and you touch your counter, you reach over. You make sure the faucets in the right place, you reach over and turn on the water control. Grab the soap dispenser and now you rinse your hands. Well, you've got to go back and disinfect all of those areas because you got juice on them. So one thing that people can do, and I think this is great for sighted cooks as well, is run a couple of inches of soapy hot water in the in the bottom of one of your sink or in a dish pan. And that way when I go, my fingers are messy and when I need to wash them so I can either use my forearms or the back of my hands if there's no, you know, contaminants on them, and then I can find my way to the sink and just immediately plunge my hands in that hot, soapy water.

Debra Erickson: And so now I now I can reach for the soap or whatever or the, you know, turn it on and nothing. I don't have to go back and decontaminate things. And plus, if I'm, let's say I'm using a measuring cup or measuring spoon and I'm done with it, I can just put it in that water. And I've already started my cleanup. And the reason you only do a couple of inches is because as a blind cook, I'm slower now. I have to be very thoughtful. And so when that water can become cold over time. And that's pretty disgusting to put your hands in cold water. So then I just have to turn on the faucet, run some more hot water into it. It's going to it's going to revive the suds, and it's going to raise the temperature of the water to be pleasant again. And I'm I'm on my way. I don't have to redo everything. Just add a couple of inches. So that is one way another safety tip that for a mixed family especially, or people, you know, where you have someone, some that can see and maybe someone that can't is that we sell something called Sharps Basket, but you can use any container that makes sense for you.

Debra Erickson: And they're, they're basically like drawer organizers, elongated. And so if I have scissors, if I have a knife, if I have anything, A peeler that could potentially cut people. They are parked in that box at my work where I'm working at. There's also an identical one at the sink. So if I am using a knife and now I'm cutting up that chicken, I really don't have time to clean the knife and put it away. I can just take it and carry it over to the sink and drop it in that basket. And I know when I get near those baskets, I've got to slow down and be careful. And the whole family knows. And so that way, oh, I can't even tell you how mad the chefs at culinary school would get when they'd find a knife in the bottom of a sink. Anybody could cut themselves. You can't see through soapy water. And so this way, all the sharps are in a predictable location until you have the time to clean them properly and put them in there and put them away. And no one's in danger then, but the family has to make an agreement and adopt it and use it consistently.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: A lot of it is common sense, would you say?

Debra Erickson: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. In fact, one of the I think the strengths of The Blind Kitchen is in its simplicity. I'm not I'm not handing you smart speakers or making you do, you know, complicated gestures and stuff on your iPhone. Mostly it's just learning to use simple tools that can achieve a task safely and often attractively, which can be a challenge as well.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And these, for the most part, are are low tech tools, would you say?

Debra Erickson: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. So Yeah. No, they're talking thermometers. That helps food safety as well, because you don't want to undercook serve someone an undercooked piece of chicken or seafood. Yeah. So that's another safety device. But in The Blind Kitchen, we keep things simple, and. But we also present more complex things that people can research on their own, such as way around, which is a tagging system, a labeling system that works through an app on your phone, and you have to buy their special tags. But it's a beautiful system. But but people, can we tell them about it? But we're not going to be the ones to teach it or sell it.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay. Okay. Can you explain a few of your most loved tools in plain practical terms, something like how something that rattles when water boils or a spout that dispenses a precise amount replaces visual cues with sound and touch.

Debra Erickson: So you've mentioned two of our most popular. The one is the boil alert disk that when you put it in the bottom of a pan and the water reaches 212 degrees and starts to boil, It rattles because the bubbles that form at that temperature force it to rattle.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I got.

Debra Erickson: One. You have one. Yes I do. I love mine. And the other thing is, you know, I'm sure Cavewomen and cavemen were able to boil water at some point in time, but they needed to be near it. And you, if you can boil water, you can be near it. You can feel the pan vibrate. You can hover your hands above it, feel the steam. But what I can do without boil alert disc is be across the room and know exactly what's happening in that pan. Right. And that that's that's I love that. And then the, the auto measure spout is the spout that dispenses exactly one tablespoon of liquid or oil, and then it stops, even if you're still holding it upside down. It's magic. It works. And it doesn't know power. It's just works with magnets and steel ball bearings. The. So there are other ones like how to measure wet liquids, especially things like vanilla and stuff without waste. And how do you know you got it right? So we have a wet measure spoon system that comes with a little. Basically you put the spoon is shaped like a ladle. That's the key to this because that's how we transfer liquids in our society efficiently is with a ladle.

Debra Erickson: And so we use that same idea for smaller amounts of liquids. We have a liquid dropper in bottles. Like if you're doing hot sauce, one thing you you're encouraged to do when you can see is just to shake the hot sauce. And you can kind of look and see the drops that fall on there, and you stop when you think you've had enough. If you can't see it, you don't have that option. You want to. You want to be careful about how much you're dispensing. And so this is this is just it's a little kind of like eyedropper. But of course, it's not an eyedropper, but a medicine dropper, but it measures exactly one quarter teaspoon of liquid. And then you can dispense that into pan, stir it, taste it. Oh, nope. We need a little bit more, but it allows you to be very precise and and have control over how much of that liquid that's very flavorful. Liquid smokes. Another thing, you don't want to overdo that, but you can. But you drop it into the pan. You're doing it in manageable amounts.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Wow. I didn't know about that one, but that sounds interesting.

Debra Erickson: It's handy.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: For a listener who's who is newly blind or newly low vision. What are the first three practical changes you recommend making in the kitchen to reduce stress and increase safety right away?

Debra Erickson: So the first thing I would suggest people to do is to set up a safe and comfortable work area and predictable. Predictability is huge. So the first thing is a work tray and you can use what it is, is basically a larger than average cafeteria tray or school tray. I use those for everything, so I have that in front of me. When I start to work, I run my sink or soapy water. That's that's the first thing. I have my sharps basket at the top of the work tray, not on the work tray, but but above it. Then I have what I call a scraps bowl to the left of it, so that if I have eggshells or or if I'm, I use the cutting board, the work trays as cutting boards to, or if I have peels, or if I have, you know, anything that I need packaging that I need to discard. I don't have to go across the room to the garbage can or anything like that. I can just drop it in there. So in my work area, everything is predictable and that gives me a it makes me calmer because I know where things are at, and I can have another work tray to the side of that on which I put the ingredients for the cookies.

Debra Erickson: I'm going to make. That way I know I have what I need and I can put it away as I go. So that's one thing, is to have a predictable work area that works for you. The other thing I would recommend is to find a way to identify and label foods in closed containers that you can't smell or taste or, you know, like two cans of soup. And that can be as simple as putting a rubber band on one can of soup, like let's have cream of mushroom and cream of chicken soup. You can't tell the difference. They weigh the same, they sound the same. They smell the same. So I, I use, I can use be my eyes or IRA or my meta smart glasses or ask my husband, what is this and what is this? And then I put the rubber band on the cream of mushroom. And the reason I do that is because cream of mushroom has a R rubber band. Chicken doesn't have an R, so even if I go back six months later, I assigned meaning to that rubber band. And and so there are many ways to find out what's in closed containers. And there are as many ways to label them.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And, you know, there are so many things you can use these like IRA, be my eyes, the meta glasses, you know, like, you know, have your choice, right?

Debra Erickson: I use them all. I use them all. I, I know I should be afraid of it, but it is a very powerful, helpful tool, especially for describing your environment or reading what's on a package to you. It's not perfect. No technology is, but it is really a game changer for people with vision loss.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Not knife safety is a huge concern for many blind cooks. What are the specific techniques that you teach for cutting and shopping Safely, especially for someone who feels anxious about sharp tools. So me?

Debra Erickson: Yeah. Well, so that anxiety is serves a purpose. It tells you you could get hurt here. So noting the anxiety and overcoming it if. But you have to be confident in the tools that you have. And we've got a couple of things I'll give you. Like we have a cut resistant glove, we call it a cut glove. And I literally can put my hand palm up wearing the glove and run a sharp knife back and forth across my palm. And I can feel the pressure and I can feel the movement, but I never, ever get cut. And it works. What the way it works is, it's first of all, it's very cut resistant, although it is thin and flexible, a little bit stretchy. But when I'm cutting, if all of a sudden I feel contact between the knife or the tool and my fingers holding the food. I'm just going to stop. And then that way I. If I weren't wearing the glove by the time my brain would have registered. Oh, something's wrong down there. You made contact. It would have been too late. So it can be as simple as that. But I'll tell you some of the aspects about the tools that we have. So one one characteristic found in a lot of the cutting and chopping tools are that they have a serrated edge, or they might have pointy, jagged teeth.

Debra Erickson: You know, almost all my much of my stuff is made with stainless steel and it's sharp enough to fabricate the food, but not sharp enough to cut your skin. And that is true of several of the tools, the avocado tool and the. We have a corncob remover, corncob cleaner. It takes it off. And the other thing that that happens in The Blind Kitchen is that we have tools where the blades exist in a cone or a tube where your fingers cannot make contact with the blades when it's being used properly and set up like one of those, we have a chopper tool that lets you push up and down on a spring loaded handle, and then so those blades are sharp and they are doing the work you want it to do. We also have like a peeler. So the other aspect of tools found in The Blind Kitchen is that it lets your fingers be close to the action without being in the food. So like the avocado tool, it number one reason for emergency visits related to food are avocado tools and or avocado cuts.

Debra Erickson: So you this it's shaped like a triangle. It's got a serrated edge. It's sharp enough to cut the skin of the avocado, but not sharp enough to cut your skin. Then at the point of it, it has jagged little teeth. Again, part of this, it's only one piece of stainless steel, but they're jagged and they can get under that seed and help you pry it out. And then the third thing is, is that it's angled a little bit curved. And it does a beautiful job of scooping out the the avocado food from the, from the skin. Other things are that we have a finger guard where if you're cutting and you're nervous, it's, it's a about the size stainless steel, about the size of a credit card. And it has two rings on the back of it. And you put your finger through the rings. So now when you're curling your hand like a bear claw, that stainless steel is between your blade and your fingers. It a knife can't cut through stainless steel. Right. So it gives you the confidence until at some point, maybe you'll be ready to just perform that same task with a cut glove. But that's Yeah, that's a good thing.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Wow. You got a lot of tools there for me to look at.

Debra Erickson: We do.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Now, before The Blind Kitchen, you were teaching cooking to blind and low vision adults as an instructor. What did you notice that your students needed most? Tools, technique, confidence, or permission to try again?

Debra Erickson: Well, it it depended on the student and their cooking experience and their blindness experience. If you've been blind from birth, you're going to have a different way of approaching the world than if you just lost your vision due to macular degeneration. So again, you meet the person where they're at. But I think for most people, mostly they needed confidence. They needed to trust that they could do these tasks safely. So even students that were blind from birth and I would have I was working for voc rehab. So these were high school graduates, so they could be 18, 19, 20 years old. Many of them had never been in the kitchen. They hadn't been allowed. So I'm their first introduction. But they. But the other thing I had, which was wonderful, is they were all motivated. They chose to take my class so it wasn't like they were forced to. And that's a big difference. If you don't want to cook, don't cook, you know, don't come here. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So so I had motivated students but the, the had been told all their lives you're going to get cut, you're going to get burned. Don't go in that room. It's the most dangerous room. But I would argue it's the most powerful room in terms of serving others and dishing out, you know, showing your love and and with nutritious, delicious meals.

Debra Erickson: And so the the answer to that is they had to they needed confidence to get started. And then then later the tools and techniques came in. But I had to the first thing I always did was to use an oven. Ovens are a little less daunting than stovetops because even though ovens are hot, once you close the door, there's a feeling of safety that comes over you with the stovetop. There's still exposure and noises and stuff. So I the way I develop trust was I would say, okay, we're going to I'm going to show you what a stove looks like. We touched the broiler while it's off, of course. And I tell them I'm turning this on until you give me permission to turn it on. And so people had never seen the inside of a of an oven. They had no idea how it worked about the racks, the pullout and all that. And so I never had a student that did not safely pull either veggie burgers or bacon that we baked in the oven out of the oven safely on the first lesson, everybody did it. Never had one fail, but some took longer than others.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Well, yeah, because they were intimidated or.

Debra Erickson: Absolutely. Yeah yeah, yeah. And it's important to notice that you've got to pay attention to your body signals.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah. Wow. Park is starting to wind down, but I got this question for you. What was missing in the world of blind cooking resources when you started? Why wasn't it enough to have mattered? Tips online and what did you want to build that didn't exist yet?

Debra Erickson: Okay, at my core, I am a teacher and I cannot believe how many hours I spent trying to find information in all these little pockets, jewels and nuggets that that came out of it. And so with the Blind Kitchen, I wanted it to be a one stop place. Whether you bought things or you just were looking for information. That's why I made all my videos available to everyone. You don't have to pay to go behind a paywall to see the videos. They're available to anyone. Right? And and the tips and techniques. And I just wanted it to be organized with vision loss. If you can become more organized, even if you were disorganized, when you could see your life is going to be so much better. And that's what the Blind kitchen was. It has categories of information and tools that have to do with each of the cooking methods grilling and barbecuing dining out, accessing and reading recipes different techniques such as cutting and chopping. We have a cutting series on there that tells, depending on the kind of food you're trying to cut, how to do it cleaning, organizing, labeling, identifying all of that stuff had to be it was it took me a while to figure out a framework for it, but culinary school helped with that. And so that that is what I wanted is an organized, predictable place of information that people with vision loss or that know people with vision loss, because there's a lot of agencies that help people with vision loss learn to cook.

Debra Erickson: There's a lot of families who there, they don't there. So let's say they have the grandmother used to be the, you know, the one that did the holiday meal or the Hanukkah or, you know, Thanksgiving. And now, because of vision loss, she's sitting on the couch watching a football game. She doesn't even care about it. And she can hear the activity in the kitchen going on. And, you know, it's kitchen's a fun place to be when you got family. You're sharing history and tips and all this stuff. So I wanted and they don't identify as blind or visually impaired. And that's a big chunk of the baby boomers that are losing their vision over time. And they don't. But they could use the information in The Blind Kitchen to solve some of their problems. Not every problem. Not everyone is completely blind. In fact, most of us have varying degrees of light perception and and clarity. And so the Blind kitchen ended up being a place where people could go and find the information they need in an organized way.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I can hear the passion in your voice and I think like being a teacher and one who is determined to remove barriers to the kitchen, it sure helps a lot doesn't it.

Debra Erickson: It does, it does. It was a natural fit actually. I had to learn it and then and I still I discovered I really loved cooking in culinary school. And so yeah, so it was it was a natural fit. And, you know, somebody once told me. Find. Find something you like to do and then find a way to get paid for it. And I think I found. Yeah. Yeah. I think just like you. Yeah. You know, it's like, I like doing this. I can reach people. People seem to respond. And so I feel very lucky to have made that connection.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And my final question of the day Debra what's next for The Blind Kitchen. Where what's next for you. Where are you going. What are you hoping to achieve. You've done so very much. I mean I'm just blown out of my mind with everything here. What's next for you?

Debra Erickson: Yeah. Good question. So the a problem I want to solve. So a lot of people, when they have vision loss, become isolated. Transportation becomes a thing. Finances become a thing. And sometimes it's just easier just to stay at home. But, you know, and so I would like to build some type of community around people with vision loss who like to cook. Now I have I know it exists in the world because I do. The ACB community calls once a month, and those people and people come to it, and I've seen friendships form because of it. So maybe it'll be cook alongs, maybe it'll be like a zoom link where I send out, here's all the ingredients, let's cook together and we can talk. Have someone manage the communications. I'm not quite sure how to do it. The other thing would be to perhaps do a podcast. We have a ton of material. We have so much content that we've already done. But right now I'm just going to stay in my lane. I've got about ten more tools. I want to get on the shelves and, and make videos for and that kind of thing. But that but creating community in some way. I would love to do that.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I think that's a great idea. I think creating community communities builds confidence. It starts Friendships. It really does a lot. It goes a very, very long way. And there are no barriers to the world, really. I mean, you can use zoom, you can use podcasts, you can use anything really.

Debra Erickson: No, you are exactly right. And when I am in, I'm when I'm in this, this call with you, I feel like I'm with you. I feel like we're connecting at a heart level. It's not an artificial thing. And I feel it when I'm doing my presentations and somebody comes up with a problem or a challenge that they have, I can hear it in their voice. Oh, that's all I have to do. And it's very refreshing to hear that because it's like, oh, I just, you know, I hope I just made their day a little better.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: It has been a privilege and a pleasure to have had you on my podcast. And I'd like to invite you back at any time you think you want to spread the word about anything. And if there's anything I can do to help you spread the message, I don't think there's much more I can do because, you know, you have it all under your your thumbs, right?

Debra Erickson: Well, there's always more that can be done. Always more so. And you have a quite a diverse background, different than mine in terms of the legal and and things like that. So if you know, you never know what another person has in their, their toolbox, that that could help you because I don't know your world and, and I say that to any of the listeners as well. If they have any ideas, I'm always open.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Great. So I want to invite you to come back anytime you think you would like to. I'd like to help you spread the message. And I want to thank you for having been on my podcast.

Debra Erickson: Thank you for having me. It's really been a pleasure. I've enjoyed our conversation immensely.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Thanks, Deborah. And you take care.

Debra Erickson: You too.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay. Bye bye.

Debra Erickson: Bye for now.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Bye.

Podcast Commentator: Thank you so much for listening. That's a wrap for this episode of Dining with Donna. Donna wants to hear from you. What did you cook? What worked and what would you like to learn next? Share your favorite accessible kitchen tips. Send in a recipe request or tell us the kitchen challenge you like Donna to tackle on an upcoming episode. And if today's show helped you feel more confident cooking without relying on sight, please share it with a friend and leave a review. Your support helps more listeners find their way into the kitchen. Until next time, keep it simple, keep it safe, and keep it delicious.