Blue Ocean World is a podcast about finding meaning from the conversations that are all around us. This week, all our friends are talking about the state of the election after the first debate. But it's hard to know how to helpfully weigh in as people who are now or have been religious leaders. So Val, Tom and Dave throw caution to the wind (or at least Val and Tom do) and dive in with a freewheeling conversation. A warning: It's not pro-Trump, so if that's unhappy, consider this your trigger warning.