Anatol Lieven & Jim talk about his latest book, Climate Change and the Nation State: The Realist Case. They cover motivating populations to take actions on climate change, the key role of nations & nationalism, the huge problem of residual elites, funding alternative energy, western government incompetence & political failures, individuality, Bernie & the green new deal, the carbon tax, nuclear power, natural gas, carbon removal & geoengineering, naive progressivism, the strangeness of the American culture wars, intelligent immigration, the importance of building social solidarity, getting clear on international priorities, global impacts of climate change, reducing air travel, Anatol's sensible approaches to climate change, and much more.