Key Learning Points:

1.How different workplace policies can support working parents returning to work and sharing responsibilities

2.The importance of challenging societal norms for childcare and work and doing what is best for your family

3.How leaders setting an example as a working parent can make cultural change happen at work

In this episode of The Parenthood Diaries, we speak to new parents André and Nikita Symes about the challenges of juggling parenting and work and how employers can help. André is co-CEO of our series partner, Genasys, and Nikita is Ops Manager at Carebit.

We begin by asking André and Nikita what things were like when they were expecting their baby, Seb. They both explain how they were excited but daunted, realising that things would be changing in their lives. Yet they also faced people questioning how they would cope with a baby, adding to their collective anxiety. None of their family members lives in the UK; some asked ‘how are you going to do it without “a village”?’

As a working mum, Nikita says that she faced judgement from many during and after her pregnancy, driving a feeling of guilt: ‘...society needs to stop telling us what to do with our time’. In this regard, André believed the lockdowns helped ‘rip open what the “norm” was with society at work’. In a normal office, he would never have brought baby Seb into his boardroom; yet in 2020, everyone had to look after their children at home. He says this sense of normalisation created empathy amongst parents - a step towards encouraging shared parental responsibility.

André then recounts that, unlike Nikita’s experience, becoming a Dad was seen as ‘cool’ despite his ‘minimal contribution’ during pregnancy and birth! Yet he still felt pressure from the world of work, a ‘general sense that you are the boss, setting the example…’. And so he did: after Seb was born he brought him along, sitting him on his lap into his meetings, which didn’t bother his colleagues at all. André tells us he feared empathy would be confused for weakness. But in fact, his team saw confidence and a good role model.

André and Nikita also talk about full-time childcare and its prohibitive cost - which can be around £2,500 a month per child in London. André says this ‘cuts people off at the knees’, forcing some to stay at home and often resulting in women losing progression in their careers. Nikita says that whilst being a stay-at-home mum may be the ‘norm’, it doesn’t always make sense. She says that some companies offer flexible hours or stagger return to work back up to full-time hours, which can keep critical experience in organisations - allowing retention of ‘a workforce that has been there a while and is loyal…just working in a different way.’ Nikita thus urges organisations to think outside the box and look at these kinds of alternatives.

Katie then asks André and Nikita what employers can do to help.  André says he wants to see the option of later paternity leave, so that Dads can create a bond with their children when they are a little bit older. He also wants to see empathy towards Dads with responsibility during working hours and the flexibility that goes with it - other Dads shouldn’t frown upon others for helping out with parenting. For example, André’s team at Genasys were told to ‘work when they need to’ on flexible hours - to great results.

Finally, we ask both André and Nikita to give us their closing top parenting tips. Nikita tells us that, as ‘your child’s first teacher and role model’,  it’s really important to take care of yourself: ‘...how you treat yourself will be how your child treats themselves one day.’. André says that it would be tough to follow that one up! Nevertheless, he reminds us that in the more challenging moments ‘it will be ok… the sun will rise tomorrow…have patience and empathy and things will work themselves out’.