At some point in life, the time will come in which we will experience at least three things: joy, pain, and grief. Joy Oguntimein, author, speaker, and pastor joins Ash for a candid conversation on how to find joy in the midst of pain and offers some helpful tips to women and millennial leaders. Prepare to laugh as Joy and Ash share their personal reflections on the highs and lows of leadership and learning how to grieve in this podcast episode.