In this episode, we talk with Joe Beda about, of course, kubernetes, but also about an organization's platform, the roles that work in the software supply chain in enterprises, types of developers, and other topics like what DevOps "is" now. This discussion will give you a good view of how to model and think about enterprise software development and operations now-a-days, and thinking through the strategy you want to take to transform your organization to be cloud native.