As the internet constricts to a handful of social media apps and monolithic content sites, the playing field has shifted towards major corporate interests in extreme ways. Nowhere is this more evident than in the streaming-sphere where the low pay for musicians and content creators is well-documented. In the case of podcasts, it’s literally non-existent. So what can be done? And what can artists do to tilt things back in their favor?

We invited musicians Jeff Rosenstock and Laura Stevenson, along with Liz Pelly, contributing editor at The Baffler and adjunct instructor at NYU’s Tisch School for the Arts, to discuss the most-pressing issues facing musicians in this new economic reality. Recorded two days before Christmas, we also talk the holidays, new year’s resolutions, Waffle House jukeboxes and the redeeming qualities of Long Island, NY.

“One of the challenges is remembering that the internet is not just social media platforms, and that a lot of people’s perception of what the internet is is just going on Google and Facebook and Twitter and Instagram and not actually thinking about what is the potential to use this medium in ways that actually serve me and my community.” —Liz Pelly on Nothing Urgent [24:15]