Daniel and Manton talk a bit more about WWDC announcements, and about having the discipline to put off playing with shiny new technologies while focusing on making progress with current projects. They talk about the practicality of adopting Catalyst in the short term, while SwiftUI may still be best to put off. They react to the Mac Pro and debate the merit of Apple selling to such a high end segment of the market. Finally, Manton admits that he's trying again to embrace direct email marketing to his customers, and Daniel agrees it's time he finally got on board as well.