In this eight minute conversation with LearnIT2teach Communications Manager Rob McBride, Carolyn Cohen describes the origins of the framework project and the need for more specialized TESL skills that has emerged. Carolyn also describes the challenges of consulting the Ontario field and reviewing training to shortlist programs that qualify as TESL training rather than service professional development. Carolyn also describes why LearnIT2teach Stage Four training qualifies as post certificate training, while the first three stages fall into the category of PD.