Ellen Judd is an anthropologist specializing in China; Barry Stevens makes films, mainly about war; and Zachary Jacobson is a mathematician concerned about global warming. As a schmooze day, this conversation was unplanned; everyone gets to discuss a favorite topic, and the discussion turned to the difficulty of addressing China's obvious human rights violations within a fair abd constructive context instead of exacerbating tensions. Is it right to consider the current forcible integration of the Uyghurs as "genocide"? For the video, audio podcast, transcript, and comments column: https://tosavetheworld.ca/episode-405-china-and-human-rights/.