In honor of George Floyd and the countless black lives lost at the hands of police brutality, Shirley and I recorded an intro to the conversation we had several weeks ago. We weren’t even sure if we should put out our original conversation, but we both experience the deep healing of nature and talk about this in our conversation. Shirley is an ethnobotanist and restoration ecologist who I deeply respect. We hope this interview can offer something in this time of great and necessary change.