Chris Logan is a primary school head teacher and rugby referee living in County Down. He talks frankly and insightfully about life as a school head, and reflects on the hot topic of how to move towards educating more of Northern Ireland's children together. For him, it's not all about "integrated" status - many schools are already walking the walk without it. And shared housing, he believes, is just as essential.

He talks about growing up in and around rugby and cricket clubs - how they influenced his values, as well as providing his social life. Refereeing has kept him involved. Like so many NI people, sport is central to Chris's life and he takes particular pride in NI achievements, with the 2024 Olympics fresh in the memory. His broader pride in Northern Ireland as a unique and amazing place to live shines through.

A political moderate, he is frustrated at the media focus on hardliners; for him, the relaxed, liberal approach of the UUP resonates more with what the Union is all about. We discuss Alliance too, and its turn towards identity politics which leaves him cold.

He reveals too a surprising comedy celeb connection, arising from a past as a performance poet - and sometime bouncer - in Manchester.