Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson and David Plotz discuss the ways that the war in Ukraine may be influencing China's future plans with guest Malcolm Turnbull; the mask mandate ruling; whether it matters that the RNC has rejected presidential debates; and Gabfest producer Jocelyn Frank signs off after many years of producing the show.

Here are this week’s chatters:

David: Mark Emem for CCN: “Jeff Bezos Missed 20,000% Gains After $250K Google Stake in 1998”

John: Kathryn Olivarius: “Necropolis: Yellow Fever, Immunity, And Capitalism In The Deep South, 1800-1860”

Emily: Rachel M. Cohen for the Intercept: “At a Pivotal Moment, Democrats Failed to Modernize Elections”

Listener chatter from Randy Switt: Christopher P. Hammon and Victoria L. Vish for National Law Review:
 “Eleventh Circuit: Service Charges Are Wages, Not Tips, Under FLSA”

For this week’s Slate Plus bonus segment long-time Gabfest producer Jocelyn Frank shares her experiences making the show with Emily, David, and John.

Tweet us your questions and chatters @SlateGabfest or email us at gabfest@slate.com. (Messages may be quoted by name unless the writer stipulates otherwise.)

Podcast production by Jocelyn Frank.

Research and show notes by Bridgette Dunlap.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Farewell, Jocelyn!

Voted “Favorite Political Podcast” by Apple Podcasts listeners. Stephen Colbert says "Everybody should listen to the Slate Political Gabfest." The Gabfest, featuring Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson, and David Plotz, is the kind of informal and irreverent discussion Washington journalists have after hours over drinks.

News

Politics

Government

In this week’s essay, John discusses the Pomodoro Routine (among other productivity routines), why he especially needs a meditation pillow, and how a particular teacher captured his heart. 
 
 
Notebook Entries:
Notebook 75, pages 8 and 9. September 2021
OReinstating the Pomodoro Routine…
Starting Marshall again…
Write Brice…
Send Laura the larger project list…
Work on budget to get accounts in order
Meditation pillow upstairs.

Notebook 18. December 6, 2009
Instapaper
Alpha Smart
Richard Hugo on poetry
Degrees of Gray In Philipsburg.

Notebook 18, page 105. June 4, 2011
Visit to Mr. Mead. He was playing piano as we entered. [During our conversation, he asked]: do you find your work fulfilling? Do you have a close circle of friends? Questions about life and living it well…


References:
Getting Things Done - David Allen
The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People - Stephen Covey 
The Questions That Will Get Me Through the Pandemic - John Dickerson
43 Folders - Merlin Mann 
The Hardest Job in the World - John Dickerson
Essays of E.B. White
“Merlin Mann” - Tina Essmaker for The Great Disconnect
More about Ernest “Boots” Mead
“Because Buying New Running Shoes is More Fun Than Actually Running” - Merlin Mann for 43 Folders
Atomic Habits - James Clear
The Creative Habit - Twyla Tharp
Free Agent Nation - Daniel Pink
“Sharon Salzberg On: Openness, Not Believing the Stories You Tell Yourself, and Why the Most Powerful Tools Often Seem Stupid at First” - Ten Percent Happier

Want to listen to Navel Gazing uninterrupted? Subscribe to Slate Plus to immediately unlock ad-free listening to Navel Gazing and all your other favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Or, visit slate.com/navelgazingplus to get access wherever you listen.
 
Podcast production by Cheyna Roth.
Email us at navelgazingpodcast@gmail.com
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

John Dickerson’s Navel Gazing: The Sneaky Pitfalls of the To-Do List

This week, Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson, and David Plotz discuss Stormy Daniels’s testimony in Donald Trump’s New York criminal trial; marijuana rescheduling; and the media’s role and responsibility in defending democracy.
 
Here are some notes and references from this week’s show:
Josh Gerstein for Politico: Stormy spoke. Trump fumed. Jurors were captivated – but also cringed.
Ivana Saric for Axios: Status of Trump’s criminal cases
Li Zhou for Vox: Marijuana could be classified as a lower-risk drug. Here’s what that means.
Sam Tabachnik for The Denver Post: Black market marijuana grows are popping up faster than law enforcement can take them down. But is legalization the cause?
John Ingold for The Colorado Sun: What have we learned about the arguments for and against legalized marijuana in the past 10 years?
Nathaniel Meyersohn for CNN: The dark side of the sports betting boom
C-SPAN: President Biden Remarks at White House Correspondents’ Dinner
Ben Smith for Semafor: Joe Kahn: ‘The newsroom is not a safe space’
Dan Pfeiffer for Message Box: Why Biden Won’t Do a New York Times Interview and A Response to the Editor of the New York Times
Matthew Yglesias and Brian Beutler for the Politix Podcast: The Times, They Aren’t A Changin’
Charles Homans for The New York Times Magazine: Donald Trump Has Never Sounded Like This
Eli Stokols for Politico: The Petty Feud Between the NYT and the White House

Here are this week’s chatters: 
Emily: Vision: A Memoir of Blindness and Justice by David S. Tatel 
John: Gina Kolata for The New York Times: Locks of Beethoven’s Hair Offer New Clues to the Mystery of His Deafness
David: Randy Yohe for West Virginia Public Broadcasting: W.Va. Gubernatorial Campaign Attack Ads Vilify Transgender Children and Kyndall Cunningham for Vox: The Drake vs. Kendrick Lamar feud, explained
Listener chatter from Justin and Katie in Columbus, Ohio: Keziah Weir for Vanity Fair: The Vatican’s Secret Role in the Science of IVF.   
 
For this week’s Slate Plus bonus segment, David, John, and Emily talk with Emily Lawler, Detroit Free Press. See Emily Lawler for the Detroit Free Press: Voters’ voices in Saginaw County; John Wisely: Legal troubles don’t dampen Trump enthusiasm as he visits Michigan; and Paul Egan: As Trump visits, Michigan bellwether Saginaw County is feeling its political juice. See also Arpan Lobo: Michigan lawmaker says ‘illegal invaders’ landed at DTW. They were NCAA basketball teams.
 
In the latest Gabfest Reads, John talks with David E. Sanger about his new book, New Cold Wars: China’s Rise, Russia’s Invasion, and America’s Struggle to Defend the West.
 
Email your chatters, questions, and comments to gabfest@slate.com. (Messages may be referenced by name unless the writer stipulates otherwise.)
 
Podcast production by Cheyna Roth
Research by Julie Huygen
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trump Wore Pajamas

In this week’s essay, John discusses an onboarding memo for his assistant Laura, and recounts his early days living and working in New York City. 
 
Notebook Entries:
Notebook 75
Onboard memo for Laura

Notebook 3, page 44. May 1991
June 17 start job. Good stuff

Notebook 3, page 46. May 1991
Tips on buying renting in NYC
Ask about broker
20s and 30s East side. Murry Hill
Live on no major avenue
Interest bearing account for security deposit
Medeco locks

Notebook 4, page 15
Scared standing on 34th and Broadway
$6 cab fare

Notebook 4, page 42
Getting lost in the village

References:
The Little Brown Book of Anecdotes by Clifton Fadiman 
Medeco Locks
“Here is New York” by E.B. White
“Silly Job Interview” - Monty Python 
John Cleese on Creativity in Management
Herbie Hancock: Miles Davis’ Essential Lesson On Mistakes
 
Want to listen to Navel Gazing uninterrupted? Subscribe to Slate Plus to immediately unlock ad-free listening to Navel Gazing and all your other favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Or, visit slate.com/navelgazingplus to get access wherever you listen.
 
Podcast production by Cheyna Roth.
Email us at navelgazingpodcast@gmail.com
 
Host
John Dickerson
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John Dickerson’s Navel Gazing: Remembering Early 1990s New York

This week, Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson, and David Plotz discuss the increasing and increasingly violent campus protests of Israel’s war in Gaza, Emily’s article on How ‘History and Tradition’ Rulings Are Changing American Law, and South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem’s chances of a vice presidential nomination after killing her dog and writing about it.
 
Here are some notes and references from this week’s show:
April Rubin, Kavya Beheraj, Tory Lysik, and Will Chase for Axios: Mapped: Where pro – Palestinian student protesters have been arrested
Sharon Otterman and Santul Nerkar for The New York Times: As Protests Grow, Universities Choose Different Ways to End Unrest
Mary Harris for Slate’s What Next podcast: Columbia Cracks Down
The University of Chicago: Report on the University’s Role in Political and Social Action
Jonathan Chait for New York’s Intelligencer: Why the Right Loves the Anti-Israel Encampments
Abigail Hauslohner for The Washington Post: House passes antisemitism bill over complaints from First Amendment advocates
Alexander Bolton for The Hill: Democrats split over campus protest crackdown
Emily Bazelon for The New York Times: How ‘History and Tradition’ Rulings Are Changing American Law
Regulations on YouTube
Calvinball on Wikipedia
The Catholic University of America Columbus School of Law: A Conversation with Justice Amy Coney Barrett
Ian Millhiser for Vox: The Supreme Court appears poised to rein in its worst decision on guns
Ulysses S. Grant Revealed: President Ulysses S. Grant On The U.S. Constitution
Martin Pengelly for The Guardian: Trump VP contender Kristi Noem writes of killing dog – and goat – in new book
PBS American Experience: Nixon’s Checkers Speech
Marc A. Caputo for The Bulwark: Trump: ‘Marco has this residency problem.’

Here are this week’s chatters:
Emily: Gal Beckerman for The Atlantic: A Prominent Free-Speech Group Is Fighting for Its Life
John: Sonja Anderson for Smithsonian Magazine: This Newly Deciphered Papyrus Scroll Reveals the Location of Plato’s Grave
David: Kenny Holston for The New York Times: Inside a Navy Submarine Navigating the Arctic
Listener chatter from Christina in Philadelphia: Marina Bolotnikova for Vox: Mega drive-throughs explain everything wrong with American cities; Wikipedia: Third place; Jake Blumgart for The Philadelphia Inquirer: Starbucks plans a new Center City location with no restrooms or seating; and Marin Cogan for Vox: The deadliest road in America.   
 
For this week’s Slate Plus bonus segment, David, John, and Emily talk with Professor Deborah Tuerkheimer about the Harvey Weinstein case in New York. See Hurubie Meko and Maia Coleman for The New York Times: Prosecutors Say They Plan to Retry Harvey Weinstein as Soon as the Fall and Maria Cramer: Here are five takeaways from the overturned conviction. See also Deborah Tuerkheimer for CNN: Reversal in Harvey Weinstein case isn’t the demise of sex crimes prosecution and Credible: Why We Doubt Accusers and Protect Abusers by Deborah Tuerkheimer. 
 
In the latest Gabfest Reads, John talks with David E. Sanger about his new book, New Cold Wars: China’s Rise, Russia’s Invasion, and America’s Struggle to Defend the West.
 
Email your chatters, questions, and comments to gabfest@slate.com. (Messages may be referenced by name unless the writer stipulates otherwise.)
 
Podcast production by Cheyna Roth
Research by Julie Huygen
 
Hosts
Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson, and David Plotz
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Should Student Protesters Be Arrested?

In this week’s essay, John discusses the art of attention and how to develop the skill of slow-looking.
  
Notebook Entries:
 
Notebook 75, page 8. September 2021
1016
 
Notebook 1, page 54. June 1990
-       Magna carta 1215 at Salisbury
-       Girls skipping
-       The Haunch of Venison
-       Chris
 
 
References:
Georgia O’Keeffe Museum
A Little History of the World by E.H Gombrich
Artist Jeff Koons
“The Art of Divination: D.H. Lawrence on the Power of Pure Attention” by Maria Popova for The Marginalian
“Gabfest Reads: A Woman’s Life in Museum Wall Labels” for Political Gabfest 
One Woman Show by Christine Coulson
“Grammy-winning artist Jason Isbell talks about the craft of songwriting and his latest music” for CBS News
A Journey Around My Room by Xavier De Maistre
“Just think: The Challenges of the Disengaged Mind” by Timothy Wilson, et.al for Science
“Our Rodent Selfies, Ourselves” by Emily Anthes for the New York Times
One Man’s Meat by E.B. White
 
Podcast production by Cheyna Roth.
Email us at navelgazingpodcast@gmail.com
  
Want to listen to Navel Gazing uninterrupted? Subscribe to Slate Plus to immediately unlock ad-free listening to Navel Gazing and all your other favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Or, visit slate.com/navelgazingplus to get access wherever you listen.
 
Host
John Dickerson
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Farewell, Jocelyn!

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