America has the highest rates of incarceration in the world. Once people leave prison the hope is that they'll be law-abiding, productive members of society. But all too often this isn't the case – four in ten prisoners are back behind bars within three years of release.

In this episode, we meet two men who want to fix the US's flawed re-entry process. And they come from very different backgrounds. Former prison warden and overseer of regional prisons, Daren Swenson, has spent his career in corrections. Georgetown University professor Marc Howard is a reformer who has long campaigned for the rights and humanity of incarcerated people.

They were brought together by Convergence Center for Policy Resolution to come up with solutions that take into account both the dignity of people re-entering society and the public safety implications of their release.