with Dr. Michael Hageloh & Dr. Bruce Fraser (Indian River State College)

Episode Summary

This week, Myles Biggs and Patrick Patterson sit down with two innovators who are shaping the future of higher education: Dr. Michael Hageloh and Dr. Bruce Fraser of Indian River State College in Florida.

Together, they discuss how AI is disrupting higher ed, not as a technology problem, but as a change management challenge. From Steve Jobs’ lessons at Apple to democratizing knowledge in the classroom, Michael and Bruce share their experiences leading transformation at scale.

They make the case that students are customers first, that knowledge is no longer scarce, and that AI, used wisely, can help colleges unlock creativity, adaptability, and epic wins for the next generation of learners.

If you care about innovation, the future of education, or how to lead through massive change, this conversation is packed with insights.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

• How Apple’s product philosophy shaped Michael’s approach to education leadership
• Why “customers don’t know what they want” still applies to students in 2025
• The death of the click economy and what it means for marketers & schools
• How IRSC is using AI to move students from curiosity → enrollment → success
• The role of fidelity (taste, judgment, human refinement) in an AI-driven world
• Why higher education must shift from “knowledge scarcity” to AI-abundant, collaborative learning
• Predictions for the future: apprenticeships, stackable credentials, and billion-dollar one-person companies

Featured Guests

Dr. Michael Hageloh – VP of Marketing at Indian River State College, former Apple executive, author, and change leader.

Dr. Bruce Fraser – Faculty leader at IRSC with a background in psychology, epistemology, and AI research, specializing in organizational change and faculty development.

Learn more:

• Indian River State College - https://www.irsc.edu/
  
  
• IRSC AI Thought Leadership Article: The Death of the Click Economy - https://medium.com/@michaelhageloh/the-death-of-the-click-economy-how-ai-is-altering-human-agency-and-commerce-533e9ac6aeb4

Takeaways for Operators & Leaders

• AI adoption is a change management problem, not a tech problem. Leaders need to prepare their organizations for cultural and structural adaptation, not just tool rollouts.
• Democratization changes the business model. Just as iTunes democratized music, generative AI democratizes knowledge; leaders must rethink what unique value their institutions or companies add.
• Customers (and students) don’t always know what they want. Leaders must guide people through a journey, painting the vision before delivering the product.
• Entry-level work is evolving. Education and employers must fill the gap with apprenticeships and practical, AI-augmented learning to prepare talent for higher-value roles faster.

Connect With the Show

• Level Agency - https://www.level.agency/
• Patrick Patterson’s LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/pattersonwork/
• Myles Biggs’ LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/mylesjbiggs/

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