flavors unknown podcast

How Structure Can Actually Inspire Creativity


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In today’s episode, I talk to Chef Hari Cameron, Chef Andrew McLeod, and Pastry Chef Sam Mason. This is a panel discussion about Creative Decisions developing the conversation started in Chapter 5 of my book, Conversations Behind the Kitchen Door

You’ll hear about how each chef approaches the creative process, and how creativity shifts through the seasons and over the years. You’ll hear the exciting current dishes each chef is working on, how they balance simplicity with complexity, and why sometimes creativity is easier within parameters. 

What you’ll learn with chefs Hari Cameron, Andrew McLeod, and Sam Mason
  • How Hari Cameron goes about the recipe process (3:34) 
  • Andrew McLeod’s everchanging creative methods (5:54)
  • What happens when you allow availability to dictate the direction (8:44)
  • Why subtle menu changes can be impressive (10:33)
  • The momentary qualities of creativity (11:24)
  • How to uplevel the humble mac n’ cheese (12:48)
  • Where sweet and savory meet in the middle (15:04)
  • How structure can actually inspire creativity (16:05)
  • The importance of culinary editing (18:27)
  • Aiming for simplicity over complexity (20:24)
  • Learning not to sweat the small stuff to preserve the quality of work life (21:22)
  • The problem with following trends (24:03)
  • Matching the food to the audience (25:19)
  • The connection between creativity and practicality (27:02)
  • A creative twist on a classic menu item (30:03)
  • Adapting a meal to match the local geography (32:49)
  • Finding a sweet and savory balance (35:06)
  • Series of rapid-fire questions.
  • Link to the podcast episode on Apple Podcast
  • Links to other episodes in the Book

    Conversation with Pastry Chef Sam Mason

    Interview with chef Hari Cameron

    Conversation with Chef Andrew Mc Leod

    Links to most downloaded episodes (click on any picture to listen to the episode)

    Chef Sheldon Simeon

    Chef Andy Doubrava

    Chef Chris Kajioka

    Chef Suzanne Goin


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    The conception of what creativity means through the lenses of a cook and a chef really changes significantly throughout the course of someone’s career. -Andrew MacLeod

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    It’s easy to blur the lines between savory and sweet towards the end of the meal -Sam Mason

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    I try to lean on seasonality when I create menus, and I think it’s the mantra for a lot of chefs. -Hari Cameron

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    Chef Hari Cameron


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    Chef Andrew McLeod


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    Pastry Chef Sam Mason


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    Links mentioned in this episode

    Order book “Conversation Behind The Kitchen Door”

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    flavors unknown podcastBy Emmanuel Laroche - Show Host

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