Episode 104 – Interview with Patrick Prill 2

Welcome to Anchored by Truth brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. In John 14:6, Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life.” The goal of Anchored by Truth is to encourage everyone to grow in the Christian faith by anchoring themselves to the secure truth found in the inspired, inerrant, and infallible word of God.

Script Notes:

In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, … All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God a may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

2 Timothy, chapter 3, verses 12 through 17 New International Version

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VK: Hello! Welcome to another episode of Anchored by Truth brought to you by Crystal Sea Books. I’m Victoria K and today we’re going to be joined again by Patrick Prill who has written a fascinating book entitled Things Atheists Say that Simply Make No Sense. Patrick was with us last time on Anchored by Truth and is joining us remotely today. We wanted to bring Patrick back on because we believe that some of the observations he has made in his book could help our listeners deal with some of the misinformation that circulates today in popular culture. In recent years there have been a number of books written by prominent atheists that have gained widespread attention in the press or culture. But all too often no one stops and looks to see whether the arguments being made by the atheists actually make any sense. Well, Patrick has taken a look and he has concluded that many of the ideas that have been widely circulated actually don’t make any sense.

Patrick has recorded his observations in his recently released book. And he aptly titled his book Things Atheists Say that Simply Make No Sense. His book would make a great morning devotional because the chapters are easy to read in just a few minutes but they give you a completed idea very suitable for meditation throughout the day. We’d like to welcome Patrick Prill back to Anchored by Truth. Patrick would you like to say a word of greeting to the Anchored by Truth audience and maybe tell us a little about your background?

Patrick: Thanks for inviting me to join you on Anchored by Truth.

- Introductory comments -

VK: Patrick, can you tell us a little about why you decided to write the book Things Atheist Say that Simply Make No Sense?

Patrick: Comments about reason for writing book.

Question List:

Patrick, you address observations made by some of the most well-known atheists of our age, people like Stephen Hawking, Peter Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens and others? But one of the great things about your book is that you are only addressing their ideas and not them as people. We think this is a critical point. Our goal when we engage with people who disagree with Christianity is to help them understand – as 1 Peter 3:15 says - “the reason for the hope that lies within us.” We don’t want to win arguments or embarrass anyone. We want to win souls. We want people to come to know Jesus so they can enjoy fellowship with Him for all eternity. Well, let’s get to some specific questions.

1. Patrick, we live in an age where utilitarianism is a very common worldview. This is the worldview that says that our “worth is based on our usefulness.” You have a chapter in your book that addresses this misconception. Would you mind telling the Anchored by Truth audience why utilitarianism is inconsistent with the Christian faith – and why is it important for us not to fall into the utilitarian trap. Please help us understand why our value as human beings goes beyond just our looks, our wealth, our strength, or our capabilities.

2. You also address a related problem that “God isn’t required for morality to exist.” In our Lord of Logic series Anchored by Truth addressed the many difficulties that arise for those who would like to find an objective system of ethics that doesn’t acknowledge God’s existence. Because without God any system of morality or ethics would ultimately be based simply on physics or chemistry. The starting point for a system of ethics that doesn’t acknowledge God is ultimately based on nothing more the random collision of atoms and molecules. We’d like to hear your thoughts on the issue of how morality could possibly originate if God doesn’t exist.

3. You also tackle the assertion that “real scientists” don’t believe in God. We think that would be news to Dr. Jonathan Sarfati who is the lead scientist for Creation Ministries International and who has been a guest on Anchored by Truth. Dr. Sarfati has a Ph.D. in chemistry and physics and he leads a team of scientists who have doctorates in a wide variety of fields including biology, physics, paleontology, and other fields related to the truth of the Bible. How do you address the notion that real scientists don’t believe in God.

4. Thank you for putting that business about who does or does not believe in God into perspective for us. Let’s move on to another topic. You have an entire section in your book on religion and you take on some very common assertions such as “religion ruins everything” and “religion is the biggest cause of war.” What do you have to say about these assertions?

5. Anchored by Truth has done an entire series on miracles. You also address miracles in your book. How do you address the assertion that “miracles can’t happen?”

6. I think that’s a very interesting insight. You’re absolutely right that “nature can’t explain the existence of nature” and Anchored by Truth has done a couple of series on this subject. In our Lord of Logic series we talked a lot about the fact that the only alternative to a Creator God are various naturalistic explanations. But, as you’ve observed, none of the naturalistic explanations provide a satisfactory explanation of the existence of the universe in the first place. Nor can they explain how the random, chaotic collision of inanimate molecules and atoms can produce life much less intelligent life. And in our Truth in Genesis series - with the help of Dr. Sarfati - we talked extensively about how Biblical creationism actually aligns extremely well with the empirical observations we get from science. And as I mentioned Anchored by Truth has an entire series just on miracles. The big point is that any worldview that wants to provide explanations has to account not just for matter, energy, space, and time – but also for life, logic, language, law, purpose and intelligence. And explanations such as the general theory of evolution or undirected physics and chemistry leave more gaps than they cover. Well, let’s cover one more topic for today. What do you say to some of the historical complaints that are made about Christianity? For instance, the assertions that “Jesus may or may not have existed” or that the Gospels are unreliable?

VK: Before we close for today, Patrick are there any final thoughts or encouragements that you would like to offer to the listeners?

Patrick: Final thoughts

VK: We’d really like to thank Patrick Prill for being our guest on Anchored by Truth today. I think we can all be inspired by the kind of reasoned approach that Patrick uses to address objections that are lodged against Christianity. Patrick’s story is just one more example of how sacred scripture –the Bible – continues to demonstrate its supernatural nature through lives that are changed for the better for all eternity by its saving power. Well, we’ve covered a lot of ground today. We’ve also seen that even atheists acknowledge that when they look at nature and out into the cosmos there is an incredible amount of design and intelligence evident. The atheists may classify this appearance of design as being an illusion. But as Christians we know better. We know that the universe and life appear designed because they are. This observation is not only Biblical. It is also logical. Occam’s razor is the principle that the simplest explanation is usually the right one. The simplest reason for appearance of design in life and the universe would be that they were designed by an omnipotent Being who had the power not only to design but to create. We’ve also learned today that many of the objections hurled against Christianity don’t actually hold water when they are examined closely. For instance, the presence of pain in our lives can serve a beneficial purpose if it used to help us cling more tightly to the true source of comfort. And it is very hard to find a basis for an objective morality unless there is a sovereign, just God that could establish a basis for true ethics and morality. Today for our closing prayer let’s pray a prayer of adoration for God the Father who is, in the words of the Nicene Creed, “maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen.” Certainly, the only path to true wisdom and righteousness starts by adoring and worshipping the One True God.

---- PRAYER OF ADORATION FOR THE FATHER

VK: We hope you’ll be with us next time when we will begin a new series on Anchored by Truth. And we hope you’ll take some time to encourage some friends to tune in too, or listen to the podcast version of this show.

If you’d like to hear more, try out crystalseabooks.com where “We’re not famous but our Boss is!”

(Bible Quotes from the New International Version)

2 Timothy, chapter 3, verses 12 through 17. New International Version

The Role of the Holy Spirit in Prayer

Orthodox Christianity has long held to the doctrine of the Trinity, that there is one God who exists eternally as three persons: the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Most people probably have well defined conceptual frameworks for the Father and Son, in part because we have earthly points of reference from which to guide our thinking. The Holy Spirit, however, is somewhat more mysterious to most of us. His mystery is deepened by the wide variety of guises in which He appears in scripture, e.g. tongues of flame in Acts, seven spirits before the throne in Revelation, seven eyes on one stone in Zechariah. Part of the solution to building a Biblical concept of the Holy Spirit is to look within the references we have to understand what He does and how He works, without trying to dwell unduly on the visual symbols used to communicate His attributes and activities.

For instance, many observers believe that the number seven is often associated with the Holy Spirit, because the number seven in the Bible is a symbol for completion, i.e. God used seven days to complete creation. When Zechariah says that the Holy Spirit has “seven eyes” Zechariah is not trying to describe the Spirit’s anatomy. Zechariah was a prophet. He knew that God was incorporeal, and his audience would have shared that fundamental understanding. Zechariah’s depiction of the Spirit’s seven eyes was a metaphorical way of saying the Spirit had complete vision of everything that goes on, or in other words, the Spirit is omniscient.

Similarly, recall that in Acts on the day of Pentecost the Spirit appeared as tongues of fire that touched the disciples and instantaneously gave them the power to preach in languages other than their own. In addition, all present heard the sound of a mighty rushing wind. Therefore, here was a visible and audible manifestation of the Holy Spirit’s ability to illuminate the heart, sweep away any impediments to His purpose, and interact powerfully with every believer simultaneously. This scene calls to mind the Spirit’s omnipotence, sovereignty (wind goes where it wants), omnipresence, and ability to empower disciples to perform mighty acts beyond their human abilities.

We learn from these instances, and numerous other ones, that the Holy Spirit is a full participant in all the attributes of deity, as holy, perfect, and transcendent as the Father and Son. Moreover, we also learn that the Holy Spirit is a personal being, not an impersonal, unaware, or unthinking force. The New Geneva Study Bible notes that “The Spirit is said to speak (Acts 1:16, 8:29, 10:19, 13:2), teach (John 14:26), witness (John 15:26), search (1 Cor. 2:10), will (1 Cor. 12:11), and intercede (Rom. 8: 26, 27). All these are the acts of an individual Person.”

It is important that we have a firm grasp on the Holy Spirit’s deity and personal nature in order to understand His role in our faith and in our prayer life. The Holy Spirit is the Person within the Trinity that applies the benefits obtained by the Son to individuals. The Holy Spirit works within the hearts and minds of people both before and after they embrace Christ as their Savior. Some people can define with great clarity and precision the moment they accepted Christ as their Savior, variously referred to as being “born again,” “converted,” or “justified.” Others cannot pinpoint a specific instant when they came to believe, often observing that they have always believed or that the awareness of Christ’s work for them built more gradually over an extended period of a steadily developing relationship.

Whatever an individual’s specific salvation experience, the Bible clearly tells us that the Holy Spirit prepared the person to receive Christ, was instrumental in providing illumination about the work of Christ, and provided the inspiration that finally brought the person to the point of salvation. Yet, the Holy Spirit does not cease working within a person after salvation. The Holy Spirit continues to encourage a person to grow in their new life, increases their knowledge of Christ and His kingdom, gives them unique gifts for service, and equips them to withstand the wiles of the world, the flesh, and the devil.

The Holy Spirit’s role in prayer is particularly important. Romans 8:26, 27 says, “In the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words.”

These verses teach us that even after being saved we do not know how we can best pray, for ourselves or others, but that the Spirit does not leave us to struggle alone. Most Christians will admit that there are times when they try to pray and literally all they find the strength to do is little more than groan or mutter. Such times can be very frustrating because we are used to seeing the focused prayers of the prophets, the carefully composed prayers at public gatherings, or the wonderful prayers we hear from others in prayer meeting and Bible studies. It is a true blessing to know that at the times we feel weakest the Holy Spirit does not cast us off but rather intercedes for us.

The Spirit’s intercession will be in a form of His choosing. He might provide fresh illumination, inspiration, or strength. He might lead us to helpful resources in the scripture or elsewhere whereby we can use words and prayers set down by others; or He might simply transform our deep-seated needs and longings into spiritual communion between the Father, Son, and us. Whatever form the Spirit’s intercession takes, we can be comforted by the knowledge that His presence in a believer’s life is unshakeable. If all chaos sought to steal the tiniest believer who has ever come to Christ, chaos would fail in the attempt. Here again, the believer’s peace and confidence are grounded in, and strengthened by, an understanding of the omnipotence, immutability, and sovereignty of God.

Because the Holy Spirit is co-equal with the Father and Son there are occasions in scripture when prayers are directed to Him, and it is certainly appropriate to remember His work on our behalf with frequent adoration and thanks. Far from being a minor player in the drama of our redemption, salvation, and ultimate glorification, the Holy Spirit is central to the entire plan and we do well to meditate upon Him, His work, and the blessings He bestows on each of us.