Ben and David are joined by Peter Rothpletz (aka Peter Twinklage on Twitter), head writer for The Don Lemon Show, to discuss his viral Guardian article, "The simple way Democrats should talk about Trump and Epstein". Peter lays out a powerful thesis for how Democrats can weaponize the Epstein scandal (01:40), explaining why it's the one crisis Trump can't escape and how it proves to even the MAGA base that Trump is a liar, a hypocrite, and a sneering elitist who protects the powerful.

However, Peter warns that simply being the "Epstein party" is a trap, referencing the old "noun, a verb, and 9/11" critique of Rudy Giuliani (05:30). He explains how Democrats must use the scandal as a vehicle to talk about kitchen-table issues, connecting the rot of the elite to the daily struggles of voters (06:05). This leads to a fascinating discussion on the real divide in American politics: "pro-system vs. anti-system" (13:58). Peter argues that to win, Democrats must run at the system and even at the Democratic Party itself, a message that has already broken through to voters on social media in a way that traditional politics has not (31:54).

Wrapping up, the focus shifts to the future. Peter answers the question of what the Democrats' worst messaging attempts have been in Trump 2.0 (45:17) before debating which 2028 candidates are best positioned. While Pete Buttigieg may be "dead in the water" (19:56), the group discusses the potential of outsiders like Jon Ossoff (21:28). Finally, Peter reveals his dark-horse pick for the presidency: Texas State Rep. James Talarico, who he believes can create a true "social and spiritual benefit to being on the left" (57:50). The episode concludes with Peter's powerful theory on "positive vs. negative empathy" and how Democrats can build a more inviting coalition for the future (1:00:18).

Follow our guest Peter @PeterTwinklage, Ben @BenBartlettt, David @michiganstan25, and the show @BrogressivePod on Twitter/X.

Read Peter's article “The simple way Democrats should talk about Trump and Epstein” in The Guardian here: [Link to Article]