This episode takes us deep into the world of diversity and inclusion with a guest who has way more experience than most. Jan Gooding was formerly chair at Stonewall and held the position of Director of Inclusion at insurance brand Aviva before most people knew their D from their I.

Jan talks to us about the role of brands in Pride, how Black Lives Matters rallies have given the physical manifestations of Pride protests a temporary home during lockdown, and how focusing on inclusion rather than diversity may help to keep some people more engaged in the conversation.