It's been four years since our first conversation with John, and this time we catch him in person during his stop in Madison Heights, MI for his Midwest tour supporting his new record.

A lot has changed in four years, but the comfort his music brings his listeners has not. Unlike his other records, Joyful Noise is his most explicitly worship-focused project—yet it was the one that almost killed him to make.

We talked about creative exhaustion and surrender. About the "embarrassment" of being a Christian artist. About bringing your anger and sorrow to God and a suffering savior who knows.

It's a deeply honest and deeply human conversation and we're really thankful we got the chance to chat again because he is someone we look up to :)

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